OP: in a PURE IC2 world - can i auto-transport liquids?
IC2-community: shure - just use gregtech
i dont like the idea of a research minigame. it would just artificially drag out the game by slowing down progress by making the player perform a tedious task.
Now that i think about it... a research minigame would go really well with the rest of the experimental build - also you can bash critics by saying, that they just dont like the research minigame, because it made the game "harder"
IC2 Experiemental adds a lot more processing and a lot more options (Solars arent the only good option, you can power with geothermal, biofuel, coal, nuclear, ect)
i dont think solars were ever a good option. way too expensive in terms of coal and iron. geothermal was much stronger in IC2 than experimental. railline through your nether portal and be done with it (if you have railcraft - if not, you just produce uu IN the nether). its good that they nerfed geothermal. to me it seems that now you got less options with energy production: you MUST go nuclear now - which is great, because if you didnt, you would miss out on some excellent mod content. and it also forces you to do some redstone wiring which is an actual meaningful increase in difficulty.
i also dont see how ANYBODY would power with the coal that he needs for diamonds or biofuel that is not stackable in a generator (or is it in experimental? i didnt try)
i agree with your balance statement. the mod can only balance ITSELF. it would be ridiculous and disgusting to make IC as powerful as equvalent exchange.
dude! you played minecraft alpha? holy shi*t!
i agree about your point of "an ic mod that is a good crowd pleaser is a bad ic mod". never the less i think some community feedback should be used in order to get the balance right. maybe its too early to start balancing this wip, but i was wondering if there could be a thread dedicated to balance (i was not even thinking about a sub-forum). because the only thread on balance that i was able to find was THIS one. and it was started by a guy who thought the friggen metal former was too expensive.
what i wanted to suggest was a thread that clearly states that the ic mod will be offering "underpowered" stuff compared to other mods but still asks the community about what they think should be changed balance wise. not to balance ic with other mods but to balance ic "internally". for example it feels weird to me that a lapotron crystal is not significantly more expensive than an energy crystal and that the crazy expensive thing about an mfsu is the mfe in it.
i know it has been suggested in the past and the devs probably dont want to hear it anymore, but giving two piles of diamond dust for macerating one diamond would help a lot in that regard. if that makes things to cheap, cost could be added somewhere else to balance things out again.
no crime. im shure youre a great guy to have a beer with. just being heavy handed you make yourself subceptible to the kind of critique i am staging here, but im shure you can deal with that.
now, what do you think about a dedicated balance thread? if i got you reight earlier, you'd rather have dedicated testers than the community commenting on balance issues?
i dont hold you responsible for anyones emotional volatility. i also dont think that "Two" guy was especially volatile - he showed more patience than can be expected by the average forum user. i hold you responsible for your tendency towards bashing people, who are trying to post an opinion that differs from your own.
it is still very common to use the community for testing. big companies do it differently (not even all of them) but its far from unheared of to have an open beta not only to test but also to help with funding the project. seeing that the devs chose to publish their wip made me think this was also the case for this ic project.
you, calling me a liar and being generally unable to write a post without using swear words, are a good example for users who turn the whole discussion into a flame war.
for the record: i dont use a modpack and never have. i play industrialcraft with buildcraft and railcraft (and optifine).
EDIT: ... i also use NEI now with the experimental build (so maybe also add CodeChicken Core)
I know how scrap works, but thanks anyways.
so there is my point from earlier: some values are probably going to be tweaked. are the devs planning on testing everything themselves, use dedicated testers, or simply use the community for testing. because if the latter is the case, i think there should be a thread where people can post their opinion about the values.
for example: with the experience i have had, it becomes more reasonable at some point to make several mass fabs and a crapton of reactors to make uu-matter without scrap (at the point where you would need a railline to bring in more scrapable material). and i dont think that this is what the devs had in mind.
ok then i definitely have an outdated version. im certainly not exagerating. i did recycle the slabs from 121 (=11x11) chunks of cobblestone (layer 55 downwards). also most of the dirt and gravel but thats minor influence.
is the limiting factor for everybody the EU? even in the old IC2 it was scrap for me. if it was EU you would just make more reactors, no?
the ammount of EU needed is fine (maybe even too low). once you got a certain number of reactors (for me it was 4) you dont have this issue.
but i AM actually complaining about the ammount of cobblestone needed. an 11x11 chunk area is quite large, yet it doesnt give me enough cobble to make quantum armor.
i am not shure if you suggest to make cobblestone generators with lava/water. i thought about that idea and experimented with buildcraft mining wells, but decided not to go that way. the solution for me was to make a railline and start quarrying somewhere else. (there is nothing but empty space under my base in every direction. i got bunches of iron, copper.... but i literally ran out of cobblestone)
id also like to give a valid thing that bothered me (in regard of scrap ammounts). i just dont know if this here is still a useful thread for balance issues because it is so heavily loaded with the previous 6 pages.
i do however think that this mod could use a balance thread, because the developers are taking such big steps in that regard and could propably do with some feedback from the community.
so this is a problem: on the one hand people want to see a final release of this mod, because it is something like THE MOD for minecraft. on the other hand they are not exactly diplomats and start writing crap that cannot really help with motivating the devs to keep working on it. on the other hand these people are the ones that are going to play this mod and their opinions should influence the devs work.
i think it would be good to set up a list on what is debatable and what is written in stone and players of the mod will just have to bite the bullet and deal with it.
- for example: it has become quite clear that the devs are generally making things more expensive in order to drag out the gameplay. you need to spend more time and ressources to get the same thing. i personally love that, but it doesnt matter. its not debatable.
- other example: i have quarried an 11x11 chunk area from layer 55 downwards, turned most of the cobble into slabs and recycled all of the cobble and slabs. it has not given me enough scrap to make quantum armor. i dont love it. i dont know if it matters because i dont know if required scrap ammounts are debatable.
bottom line: it is common practice in game devellopment to use the community as testers in order to find bugs and balance the game. with this mod the communication between community and devs has become so sour that it lost its usefulness. my suggestion: make a thread with very strict rules about how to discuss a balance issue - delete posts that violate these rules without warning.
i think you will find that half of the posts that ought to be deleted in THIS thread are actually by people that are trying to defend the devs work.
well maybe he was wrong. mostly he said that he didnt like the new system with wires, plates, casing and the metal former (which i understand because at first i hated it too). And him drawing conclusions like how it forced him to stand waiting for a machine to finish is just wrong (as you said).
its just that some users cheered each other up in flaming him (most notably MagusUnion - that kid thought it was hillarious that his 1000th post on a forum was an immature flame post).
Maybe im talking to the wrong guy here. im not shure if the posts that made me wanna puke were written by you. i just felt kinda bad for this guy, because he could have used some backup, because mostly his position was in a way understandable - hes maybe not a hardcore ic-player and many will feel like he did.
sorry for accusing you to not having read his posts. obviousely you did. but still. your description of the argument was a little... off... in my opinion.
if this is how you percieved the discussion, you lost patience because you didnt understand what that "Two" guy was saying.
in fact: if THIS is how you percieved the discussion you lost patience because you were not reading his posts.
i just read though 6 pages of this forum to find out that i am late for the party.
the 6 pages were about a guy saying that hes not happy about the changes in the experimental build. after sufficient flaming from 4-5 guys he gave up trying to reason with these people.
thats one contributing member of the ic community gone. there are too many of those anyways, i guess.