Posts by HeadHunter67

Autoassign will, for obvious reasons, set itself back to 0 after it runs.
Otherwise it might change all the block IDs every time you loaded the game.
Try deleting or removing the config (keep a backup!) and launch the game to let it create a new one.

Quote from Saul_Goode

...why does this conversation bother you so much... nay- Why does my opinion bother you this much?

Because it's irrelevant. It accomplishes nothing, it changes nothing, you've said everything you're going to say and you just keep saying it again and again.

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Am I not free to discuss it with others?

You're not "discussing" it with anyone. You're carrying on. You've become that boring guy at the party who has one story and keeps telling it to everyone around him, oblivious to the fact that nobody cares.

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Something is clouding your reasoning because it seems that you keep making this about me and how pointless this is instead of showing that my opinion doesn't have merit.

You keep carrying on and on about something you cannot change, you've appointed yourself the speaker for the unwashed masses, and I'm the one whose reasoning is clouded?

When you started out, you acted like you were fighting for someone's rights (not that he asked you to) and made it sound like you wanted to change the system. Now, you say that's not what it's about.
I'd ask you again to tell me what you think it's really about now, but if I ask you twice I'll get three different answers.

You're starting to sound like a broken record. And it's the same record we heard last time around. I don't think anyone cares - but if they do, perhaps you could continue it with them in PMs.

You created an account just to insult the person whose update you want so badly?
Wow, that's gonna help.

Quote from Saul_Goode

Again... there are those that feel it was an imagined threat and that her license need not be invoked.

But she was not one of those people. Her license, her evaluation... her decision.

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Her motivation for objecting in this case were her future plans, code that she herself has not implemented. Work you have not yet done is not covered by copyright.

"redPower", "Blutricity", and the items used in the recipes ARE all covered by that copyright, regardless of what she has or has not yet done with it. So you clearly don't understand what a copyright protects.

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I am free to determine for myself. Opinion. Kinda the point- I object to Eloraams evaluation of this. Therefore, a thread is created.

Your determination is irrelevant, your opinion has no influence on her decision, your objection doesn't change what's happened... Therefore, a thread is meaningless.

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Where would modding be if Mojang had insisted on getting out of beta and with a proper API first?

Well, Immibis still wouldn't have his add-on, and you'd have to gripe about it to the people who actually care.

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Because he's a kid (no offense immibis) that got excited and made an honest mistake? He sat down to learn... he succeeded, and was proud of himself? He didn't intend to harm Eloraam, he simply fell afoul of a developer that is in contrast to the PRECEDENT set by the community around her.

It's not that he made a mistake - it's that he, and you, couldn't simply accept the resolution and let it drop. Unlike you, he took the matter to the RedPower thread. However, he handled it poorly and if anything was accomplished, it was only to make Eloraam MORE reluctant to let other people touch her mod. So, well done.

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I've not demanded Eloraam appear and account for herself. If that is what I wanted then I would take this to her.

No, you wanted to take to the soapbox and make yourself look important by standing up for an issue you admittedly don't even have a stake in. You took it upon yourself to create the thread before you even found out all the facts, and you've continually backpedalled and revised what it is you're here to talk about. At this point, you're just flapping your gums to people who don't care, about something you cannot change and don't honestly care to change anyhow. It's like listening to Al Sharpton.

Quote from Saul_Goode

It's not about her license. It's about what she feels threatens her. In this case there are some that think this might have been an imagined threat, and that Eloraam may have been a bit over-sensitive.

But the license is the means by which she protects her work. And protection, by definition, implies insulation from threat. So naturally she will enforce her license when she feels her work has been threatened.

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Eloraams work WOULD NOT have been harmed, except when layered in half-formed, hypothetical what-ifs.

That's not up to you or me to determine - that is solely subject to her evaluation.
To begin with, it would set a precedent that people don't even need to extend the proper courtesy of asking for permission to decompile the code and distribute an add-on to her work.
As I've stated above, this begins the erosion of the author's rights. One can hardly claim a moral high ground when one cannot even ask "May I, please?"
And when one does ask and is told "no", one should respect that - or forfeit their claim to have their own rights respected in return.

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It's not about her license, it's about IF she needed to object at all.

No, it's about why Immibis felt he didn't need to ask and why you cannot simply respect her right to control the use of her work.
As is the common theme in our previous debates, she doesn't owe anyone an explanation. She can do as she pleases for whatever reason, or no reason at all.

Quote from Shadowclaimer

Well actually I like your final section a lot, and for that (even though you won't care) that's gained a ton of respect from me.

Actually, that's nice to hear. I may not care if someone doesn't like me or respect me - but I'd never dismiss those who do.

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I understand why you fight for her and I apologize if I've insulted you in such a way now at the very least.

And I likewise apologize if I've given offense. My issue is not, of course, with you - it's with the erosion of creative rights. I don't so much fight "for" Eloraam (though I respect her as a developer), but I'm strongly in favor of her right to govern the usage of her work.

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I'm just someone who believes the Minecraft community needs to stop trying to pigeonhole itself into specific domains BTW style. Forge was meant to encourage people to interbreed mods and create addons, not to split us apart, and its odd seeing one of Forge's chief founders being so against it.

I don't think that's what she's after - but she and I both know what happens when you submit to "design by committee". Heinlein once said that an elephant was "a mouse, built to government specifications". I can imagine the elephant that would result if Elo lets everyone do what they please with her mod. It's always wiser to err on the side of caution with such things, because once you let that animal out of the cage, it's next to impossible to put it back in.

Even though FC and I have had our disagreements, I've always respected his sovereign right to do as he pleases with his mod. It would be nice if everyone could benefit from some of his great ideas, but I can reasonably understand why the compromises he'd have to make would interfere with his creative vision. And FC and I have been able to put that animosity behind us and agree to disagree when necessary. I'm perfectly willing to do that here as well.

At least you are able to accept the validity of my reasons for standing behind Eloraam on this issue. That's a refreshing change in this thread.

Quote from Shadowclaimer

Wasn't our goal to change her, she isn't going to change.

Then you're just engaging in academic masturbation.

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Its my hope that you, her diehard fans, would realize she doesn't give a damn about you so you can waste your breath towards defending something that actually deserves it.

Don't take this personally, but Eloraam has done more for me and my enjoyment of the game than you have. She's been helpful when I have had issues, attentive when I have had concerns, and she delivers a mod that I find useful and downright essential to the way I play. So it's not a waste for me to support her in her decisions. I'm smart enough to realize that alienation can mean the death of the mod.

If you're concerned about "wasted breath", I'd recommend you conserve your own. I've made it clear that I have my reasons for my position, and they're perfectly valid. Saul's never been able to convince me of anything and nothing you've added has moved my position one bit. If what you've both been trying to do all along is convince us, then I must sadly confess that you've failed in that attempt.

At this point, probably best to take the soapbox and go home. I'm sure Saul will find another "lost cause" you can help to champion soon enough.

Quote from FenixR

i would love for this to died out, because like i have been saying since several post backs, "This is going in circles".

I agree completely.

To those who think Eloraam is in the worng, I'll close with this: Good luck trying to get her to change. Don't talk to us about it, talk to her.
Nothing you say to US is going to ever convince HER to change her ways to suit YOU.

Is that clear enough, everyone?

Quote from FarFarAway

Actually I dont think so, anything going faster will also need more Energy.

You're missing the point. The fact is, the energy used is entirely dependent upon the work being done. If it's done in half the time, it takes twice as much energy per tick - but the end total is the same.
That's just basic physics - and it also happens to be how the things actually work in the game.

Quote from sirbrandino

And no I won't use redpower's lights, as it is free light energy.

So are torches - but RedPower lights are more costly to make.

Quote from silentdeth

The machine itself IS a tank, with 20 buckets of space..

Of this, I am aware - but since it's got no GUI, he needs some way to get the liquid out.
If pipes aren't connecting, that's your issue to resolve - I merely suggested a way that he could get the oil out without connecting a pipe to the machine.

How about a screenshot of your setup?

Quote from Shadowclaimer

I'm not being a dick to Eloraam by saying that because she deems it unallowed for someone to make a mod for her mod that its outside her domain.

But it most certainly is in her domain. She possesses sole right to the intellectual property upon which the add-on is based. The names, items and concepts within the add-on are all property of Eloraam.

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He, as a person with access to the internet, has the right to create the addon as much as she does to make the mod, shut the mod down, whatever.

See, that's where you're wrong. He has the right to make his own mod, no one disputes that. What he doesn't have the right to do is to hang on her coattails and make an unauthorized add-on.

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She had the right to pursue him over the addon but whether she had the right to shut it down is wherein the issue lies. I'm not debating whether she can pursue those who break her "copyright" (although I still think those copyrights are far from legally binding)

Then you need to read up on copyright. The mere act of publication grants it. And that's already been established.

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If Elo wants her mod to be so fan-friendly if she really craves compatibility and fosters friendship between mods, how come her copyright doesn't allow addons? I truly do find her to be a selfish modder and what the community shouldn't strive to be or follow.

I think you mistake what she's trying to do. She's trying to make the mod SHE wants to play - I fail to see how other people are going to accomplish that.
The fact that she shares her work should be sufficient to dismiss your claims of "selfishness"

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I don't like Elo, she puts her mod before anyone else's. Its her way or the highway. Which although she has the right to do, doesn't make her a nice person for it. She has stated she's making whatever she wants. Tell me, is THIS the kind of author you really want to be a fan for?

As a matter of fact, YES. I completely respect an author's right to do whatever they wish with their own creation. As for whether or not she's "nice"? I've never seen her be unkind, even to her detractors. She simply will not compromise just because others tell her to.

The alternative is to support a developer like you, who clearly doesn't respect the rights of others to control their own property.

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As a note, jumping into "what ifs" and rolling your eyes at me isn't how a debate is carried out my friend

Don't presume that I'm your friend until you've earned my friendship. Yes, I did propose a "what if": What if mod authors supported each other's rights rather than try to erode them? The same could happen to you - and if you don't care, then that just shows your utter lack of empathy. I roll my eyes because you clearly still don't get it.

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Everyone makes assumptions about the copyright rules because of the fact the MCF tried to make them out to be something they weren't.

Perhaps you don't understand that these copyrights exist regardless of Curse's policies - they merely established the rules to cover their own asses. Even if such policies did not exist, authors would still retain the right to limit use and distribution of their property. I understand intellectual property law better than most people - it's part of my professional education. And your refusal to accept Eloraam's enforcement of her rights does not in any way change her ability to exercise them.

So, it sounds like what this issue is really about is "Eloraam's a big meanie". And since that's the only thing with which you can legitimately take issue, I can suggest only the one solution you have available to you:
Don't use her product. That's your only right as regards her work. But as soon as you download the file, you are legally signing your name in agreement to her Terms of Use - so you cannot then disagree with their validity.

Quote from Shadowclaimer

I'm justifying the right of someone to make a mod for a mod.

Sorry to inform you that no such "right" exists. It depends entirely upon the permission of the author whose work you intend to modify. Mojang permits it; Eloraam does not. Both are within their rights to do so.
In cases of use of others' intellectual property, the only "rights" you have is what they grant.

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Elo's only "right" to have it taken down was because her friend, Al, runs this site, if she tried to use that same protection on MCF or anywhere else on the internet it'd be legally unjustifiable.

Really? Try posting an unauthorized RedPower mod on the MCF and watch how quickly they lock it, delete the link, and BAN you.

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Google "Metallurgy Minecraft", see how many damn times my mod has been stolen or reposted under other adflies, see how many people have taken MY creation and reposted it elsewhere. There are 4-5 pages of google results of my mod being posted elsewhere, half of which don't give credit. Hell the largest source of downloads for my mod (30k+ of them) is minecraftdl and NOT my main thread. So before you go jumping the gun and calling someone else out as inexperienced or out of their league go do your research.

Very well, I must then revise my statement. In light of the fact that you ARE a mod developer, there now remains no possible way that you can justify the misappropriation of others' work.
Or is it merely that you expect others should be bound by the lax wording that permits unauthorized use of your mod?

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Turning a blind eye is not permission.

When it comes to defending one's license to their IP, it most certainly is. Awareness of a violation and failure to defend against it sets the precedent for permitted use. That is why companies must aggressively defend their copyrights, otherwise they lose them.

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She can't call copyright on Redpower if it includes Modloader or ModloaderMP or Forge or any API because they all contain Minecraft's base materials

How can you be a mod developer and not even understand what you're talking about? RedPower doesn't contain any of that - it requires it to run. Forge mods don't modify base Minecraft classes, and all of the mods you mentioned must be installed separately to function.

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So stop being dicks to the poor kid who modded a mod

Stop being a dick to the person who put so much time and effort into making the mod he then modded. Without her, without RedPower, his add-on is irrelevant and useless. So he owes it to her to respect her wishes.

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You guys are blowing this WAY out of proportion, and making this kid out to be something he's not, and that's where I draw the line.

Perhaps if you drew the line at defending an individual author's right to determine the permitted use of their own intellectual proprty, we wouldn't have to defend it so far behind the front.

You should be able to just put a tank right next to it and the tank will fill.

Quote from Shadowclaimer

What rights? You guys are aware those little "copyrights" people paste at the bottom of their posts aren't legally binding correct?

Aside from the fact that they actually are, I find it amazingly hypocritical that you complain about how Eloraam "squashes" someone else, and then proceed to try and justify trampling all over her rights in such a childish fashion.

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We don't have Notch's express permission to release his code yet we do anyway everyday? Its hypocritical to think that this guy did anything different than Elo has done a thousand times.

You don't even make mods, do you? You have no idea what's needed to make a mod, but you think if you word it that way, it'll support your ridiculous postition. And if you did make a mod and someone misused it or stole itl, you'd be the first one in here crying about it.
As I stated before, Eloraam's mod does not violate Mojang's license. If it did, they would have shut her down and locked the thread sometime before page 885, don't you think?
If, as you allege, they are aware but "turning a blind eye", then guess what? That means they are permitting its use. But how you make the leap from that, to saying that this remove's Eloraam's rights to protect her work... I can't even begin to see where your brain makes that connection.

Your argument basically comes down to "I'll do what I want" and "Other people do it, why can't we?" Sounds like the sort of thing I'd hear from a bratty kid that hasn't been spanked often enough. Your arguments are not helping anyone here.

I think that this add-on should be integrated into the main mod, just as electric treetaps and solar helmets have been.

Quote from Ook

More balanced? Have you seen the Mk. 3 collector? that and a item maker chest (forgot it's name) == cheat mode.

The Mk3 collector? The thing that requires, among other things, THREE diamond BLOCKS to make?

As for the Condenser, it's pianfully slow and requires external power to operate at all. The only way to get it to go faster is to feed it material from an Antimatter Relay - which requires a diamond block per tier as well.

Your comments indicate a clear lack of understanding of how the mod works; since your criticism is based on that lack of understanding it's not worth much.

Quote from Saul_Goode

My GOD... why is it that you cannot view this in the context that it is intended?

Because you've vacillated on exactly what that context is, because you've been unable to satisfactorily articulate that context, and because whatever context you've thus far conveyed is immaterial to the Way. Things. Work.

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Who here would have liked to have seen a mod with this functionality? Who here would like there to be a mod that converts between Eloraams Blutricity and Alblakas EU?

I'd love to. But that doesn't mean I have the right to demand it if Eloraam doesn't want it.
You should be thankful that I don't always get what *I* want...

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You can mock me all you like with terms like 'Robin Hood' and 'voice of change' or 'folk-hero', but that just tells me that you have resorted name calling after all your arguments have been invalidated.

Dream on. Our argument stands by virtue of the facts. Those being: Eloraam didn't want the add-on distributed, and it was removed. Alblaka supports her wishes and she's got every right to do so.
So, you see, your arguments have no validity on their own merit. As much as you'd like us to be able to argue your points, we simply can't because there is nothing to them.
We've got nothing left to do but to try and disabuse you of the notion that you can accomplish anything more than making yourself look ridiculous and overblown.

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Yet you said that you are skeptical. Doubt is the definition of skeptical.

Is English your primary language? You may want to review my statement and analyze the syntax. I specifically said "I am skeptical of the support" NOT "I am skeptical that you received any message".
My skepticism is specifically about the kind of "support" you'd receive from people who aren't even confident enough to back you in public. That's diffident at best, and won't help you to accomplish anything.

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Aside from Eloraam objecting, do YOU see anything wrong with this?

Eloraam objecting is all I need to know. She has the right... so yes, that makes this wrong.

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Honestly... do you think this would have done harm?

I think advocating the erosion of an author's intellectual property rights is the most harmful thing one can do on the Internet. I bolded that so that you are clear on it.

You are continuing to belabor a point and the only thing you've provided in defense is that you "want it", it would be "cool to have" , and "it wouldn't hurt". That's the sort of argument you hear froma child who wants a toy they can't have.

Quote from Qweets

Also why do so many ic2 players use Equivalent exchange? That mod seems so cheap basically like cheating. It just seems weird that the same people who like IC2 also like a mod that basically lets you cheat with some item that mines holes for them in like 3x3 or something like that and lets you turn anything into anything, seems like you might as well use NEI or TMI lol.

I felt the same way once, too - then I tried EqEx and enjoyed it.

The latest version (6.16) is extremely well balanced and fits nicely with other mods. Sure, there are still very powerful items - but they are very expensive. It takes the equivalent of 128 stacks of cobble to make a diamond now... or one stack of coal. Hey, that sounds like another mod we all like to use...