Well. Direwolf just put out a video about this. This seems less and less like a bad joke.
Or more and more like one ...
Posts by SynfulChaot
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There's at least one good thing about this announcement, it is catching attention about IC2.
It also raise the bar for April Fool Jokes.Yes. The wrong kind of attention. If it is indeed a joke then there will be a lot of crazy and unhappy 'RF-only' fans and the joke itself will have worried many EU fans that love both systems.
Also jokes are supposed to be funny. I feel that this is anything but.
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If this is, indeed, not an ill-advised April Fools day joke then I've gotta say I'll be quite sad at the loss of a good power system. IC2, to me, is defined by it's more complex power system and without that then I don't think it has any draw for me in any way.
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Fourth jetpack? Sunshine? ... Solar jetpack? Land before it's night! Land before it's night!
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Some one really ought to have made compact reactors.
Only if the explosions are that much bigger!
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Yeah, but what i meant is that 512 solar panels uses alot more of resources. Mainly time, space and logic.
Precisely. It takes mechanics and thought instead of just ... place and forget.I did the whole Compact Solars thing once back in 1.4.7. I found it ... unsatisfying. I mean ... having all that power was *great*, but it was ... boring. Having a couple HV Solars outperform a reactor that takes planning, infrastructure, containment, and constant uranium acquisition really seemed to defeat the purpose of bothering with a reactor anymore, you know?
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Well poweloss happens only if you reach more then 50 blocks^^" (With tin cables)
And intelligently group and route them into Batboxes within that 50 block limit, then transition to other cabling from there, eventually ending in glass fiber cables and occasional repeater transformers or MFEs/MFSUs.But this only matters when you're playing IC2 Classic with it's completed e-net.
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Nope not really. With 512 Solar pannels you used Tincables they had the same powerloss as the exensive diamond cable. And if you made it right you were able to place 512 solar pannels withoit any powerloss...
Yup! "Solar Flowers" I think people called them. Make a giant field of them with the right cables and you had little, if any, loss. -
The main issue with the XU gens is that they're so cheap yet output the same as a dynamo (or more). The pink generator for example just outputs energy based on whether it has pink in the name (pink cobble anyone?). IC2's reclusiveness of late probably wouldn't have made a difference, because it's RF being designed to be flexible and widely used allows it to be widely abused, unlike EU.
The thing about all the generators that have TE/BC equivalents is that they (mostly) give the same energy per unit *as* their equivalents. The two exceptions are the survivalist generator, which gives more energy, but at a slower rate than even BC engines, and the high-temp gen, which gives more if you let it heat up. Both make sense to me. The former is designed for making the most of little and is designed exclusively for early game (and thus shouldn't have x8 or x64 versions at all, IMHO) and the latter has a similar 'always on bonus' principle to RC's boilers. I should note that x8 and x64 versions of the high-temp furnace go through a truly prodigious amount of fuel in a startlingly short amount of time. As for the cost of them? I honestly haven't looked. I *like* my boilers, dynamos, and engines, thankyouverymuch. Plus I could never stand the aesthetics of the x1 generators.And don't really count the pink generator as anything serious. It's a sorta joke/gift generator made for Aureylian, IIRC.
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Extra Utilities and EnderIO both reck TE's balance and allow you to skirt around them. Nothing does that to the IC2 macerator for example (that uses EU). No one would break IC2's power balance as the macerator using 2EU/t is already really small, as it's impossible to skirt around making a generator which gives you 10 EU/t right at the start. An addon wouldn't fit in with IC2 if it tried to break that, while with RF mods it's almost expected.
I can't speak for EnderIO as I don't play it for a multitude of reasons, both aesthetics and balance related.As for XU, if you're talking about the x8 generator, then they aren't *that* broken but are probably unnecessary. If you're talking about the x64 generators, then yes they are absurd and more than unneeded. But you know what they remind me of? Compact/Advanced Solars and the windmill variants. Mostly because they do the exact same thing. All they are is 'compressed' versions of the base energy gen that require eight of the previous level and function as eight of the previous level. I hold that the x8 and x64 generators are no more broken than Compact/Advanced Solars. Note that I do consider Compact/Advanced Solars broken and refuse to use them because I feel that they trivialize power gen. Been there, done that. For the same reason I disable XU's x64 generators, and sometimes the x8 as well, though at least *they* still require automation.
You say that noone would break IC2's power balance, but that is pure opinion. So long as the API enables energy generation outside of IC2 then people can break the balance. Will it fit in? No. But honestly they don't fit in too well in the RF environment either.
But I think we're getting wildly off topic.
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I'll do what I can to help with the reactor thing as it's what *I* consider to be a crucial feature of IC2. Just let me know.
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No the reason why MJ died out was because MJ 2.0 had a critical problem which the dev did not take care of fast enough.
And i think Lemming saw that and used it as step assist.The main problem that MJ had was that it was really hard to support because of the way how the dev team shut it of. Well that was going the wrong way.
As it turned out that the dev team will not change the MJ api and TE3 came out and gave an better option to add power into machines, the simply jumped over... ^^"
Actually, IIRC, the reason MJ died out is that RF offered a friendlier alternative to MJ that the community embraced. And RF only came into existence because one of the BC devs, Covert, I think, made the 'perdition' mechanic hardwired into the MJ API and removed all non-hacky ways to subvert it. As Lemming didn't like the mechanic but respected MJ he chose to split off from it peacefully and created RF for TE. -
I think 80 RF/t baseline is quite nice, actually. The machines all require the same amount of power so the base energy rate of the dynamos is matched so you don't need to spam more dynamos just to power machines with 'lower end' energy sources. Remember that the amount of energy contained by the fuels is the same between each, so TE isn't making more energy, just lowering the amount of 'engine/dynamo spam'. And lowering machine spam/raising performance is sorta part of Lemming's schtick.
And again, EU can be broken in the *exact same way* as RF is broken. Yes, you always need IC2 in the mix ... but what RF pack *doesn't* have TE in it? The biggest difference is that IC2 already has 'endgame' fast energy gen in the form of nuclear reactors, something that TE doesn't have. But IC2 also has consumers for such a high amount of energy. The Thermal Series does not, thus had no need to create such 'advanced' energy generation.
So long as the IC2 API allows other mods to generate EU then EU is *just* as open to being broken as RF is.
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Notice how all the mods you listed used to use MJ. Apart from the Thermal series which isn't really balanced at all, it just adds 80 RF/t generators which compare to Buildcraft's 10 RF/t for the same fuel. EU really couldn't be broken like that simply as there isn't the same massive power draw you'd ever need that much power for. The old E-net also made large amounts of power awkward, so that's probably why it never happened.
RF is just an evolution/simplification of MJ when MJ started implementing 'features' that Lemming didn't care for. For all intents and purposes, it's basically MJ 2.0.As for balance, the Thermal series is very well balanced within itself. Remember as that it's RF instead of MJ that the Thermal Series is the one setting the base 'balance', not Buildcraft. It has well paired energy creation to energy consumption within itself. And yes, they may create more RF/t than Buildcraft/Railcraft/Forestry engines, but IIRC the energy for the same amount of fuel is on par between them.
And EU still *could* be broken like that if someone chose to create a mod like BR. You say it can't happen because there isn't a massive power draw that you need that much power for ... but look at the Thermal Series and the Buildcraft/Railcraft/Forestry trio. *None* of those have *anything* that requires such an immense amount of power. That's why none of them have engines/dynamos that make that much power. The problem is created entirely by external mods that don't respect the balance set by the 'base' mods. EU is as vulnerable to that as RF is. The only reason we don't see it now, I think, is that so few people actually *play* IC2 these days that there just isn't the desire to create mods or add-ons for it outside of those that already like and play IC2 and, thus, are more likely to respect it's inherent balance.
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As if RF could ever have unified balance. Big Reactors is evidence how much that idea failed.
RF is 'balanced' with mods that want to retain that sense of balance. The Thermal series, Buildcraft, Railcraft, and Forestry all retain it well. The problem comes with mods utilizing the API in ways that 'up the power level', such as Big Reactors. That's not a fault of RF directly. The same thing could happen with EU as well if a mod creator wanted to do the same.I'll note that I don't use BR. Not because it's OP (It's configurable, so I'd nerf the generation rates *immensely*) but because it has no failure conditions. I'm sorry, but a nuclear reactor should go critical if you don't do it right.
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My personal feeling on the cost of recharging tools is that the baseline cost for any rechargeable tool should be set by the base mod for that power system. For RF tools, that's Redstone Arsenal. For EU it's ... IC2. Other mods should strive to retain that balance. It shouldn't be on the base mods to 'up their power level' to compete with tools external to the mod, even if they do utilize the same power system.
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So now to the reactor: There will be a steam reactor that only produces steam. That also depends on the reactor setup and the flow of fluids.
I'll hope, then, that this is a high-ish priority as having the ability to create steam directly with the reactor is needed for 'feature parity' with 1.4.7 IC2 classic. It's also a feature I desire greatly as it allows better interplay with non-EU tech mods for power generation. -
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Well aroma, at some part you are right and some part you are wrong...
IC2 Drill cost always the same, is always same coplex and you can not modify it at all. (The modify part is totally ok),
but if you compare it to TC there is also a complexability there but it is much lower then the IC2 ones.IC2 Exp = You have todo a lot of stuff to get a tool that never breaks, can mine about 200-120 blocks (with backpack) and its mostly not worth.
TC = You have to make a little bit of before steps and then you make a tool, and then it is the roule: You gain what you give.
And to compare: TC tools have a way higher powercost with mining then Drills (i think its +10 times per block)
I have to agree with Aroma. TCon is ... wildly overpowered and 'cheap' compared to most non-TCon tools. Step back and take a look at any pack with TCon in it. How often do you see non-TCon tools or weapons being used? And when they *are* used, are they not (nearly) always the most powerful tools/weapons from their respective mods? It's to the point that, despite liking the concept of modular tools and the mechanics of the mod, I've removed it from my pack as noone even *touched* the other options with it around.Just adopt the damn GT enet and be done with it. Do it. There isn't anything that can be come up with that is so vastly superior that it justifies X years of IC2-hiatus.
My feelings exactly. It's working, functional, and already in 1.7.10. Even if it isn't the final design for IC2exp's enet, it's still familiar to those that have played IC2 classic, it's intuitive if you engage your brain, and it's more complex than the RF-level of simplicity that the IC2exp enet is currently at. If I want RF-levels of simplicity I'll just play only RF mods, you know? -
This is a question more than anything else.
I looked in the configs and I noted that there wasn't the old option for reactors to output steam instead of EU in the presence of Railcraft. Does that mean that reactors are EU only?
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Most if the new things are pretty simple, and you can work them out in creative in like 5 mins. Some features, like the steam generator, are a little more complicated, but there's a big long wiki page I wrote about it. I think a lot of new mods are making people subconsciously lazy and causing them to shy away from things that aren't 100% obvious from the start, which doesn't encourage people to try and experiment with things like IC2's cool new stuff and help document it in the long run.
Having a core of documentation to begin with is quite nice, if not essential. Knowing nothing but the name and the very vague knowledge, if they even have that, of what it's supposed to do just isn't enough for a majority. And no, I don't think it means those people are lazy. It just means they want to know the basics of the systems in question so they can expand and learn from there.
As a modpack creator, I like being able to grok the basics of a mod without needing to play through the entire thing myself so I know whether or not it would be a good fit for the pack, as well as how to tweak things so there is good interplay between them. If I had to do learn each and every mod from undocumented scratch ... I'd always be like half a year behind as Minecraft isn't my only hobby.
