Tower of Power: CRCS Edition!

1st Official Post

    Okay, so we remember my Tower of Power which has lots of little reactors that can produce a lot of power in a relatively compact footprint. But what if you aren't satisfied with that? What if you have HAYOish dreams of banks of Matter Fabricators, all of them demanding extreme power? What if you dream of combining high efficiency with rediculous EU/t output, and to Herobrine with the cost?


    I had that dream. This, my friends, is the result.



    You will notice a lot of ME Network devices. These are courtesy of Applied Energistics v12b, which is available for both MC 1.5.2 and for 1.6.2. Fuzzy import buses and Fuzzy export buses. Because you can now tell them what percentage of health they can apply to. Meaning you can automatically pull out cooling cells when they hit 25% or below, you can insert cells which are greater than 99% full, you can even automatically pull out depleted cells automatically!


    The beast in the middle is my DDoS Double Stacker Reactor. You will note the extraneous OC Vents which apparently don't do anything. These are there as an Engineering Buffer, in the rare event that for some reason the reactor ticks between the time that the nearly depleted cooling cell is pulled and the full cell is replaced. Theoretically, that should never happen, but I do not believe in 'should' when dealing with nuclear forces!


    The external cooling towers are based on this design by Someone Else 37 in the DDoS thread.


    As you can see, it produces 1600 EU/t, and it fits snugly in a 9 x 9. You will note that it outputs directly to an HV Transformer, then to a battery of four MFSU's. If I had just hooked up a single MFSU, it would have only produced a mere 512/t output from it, so I had to build four of them for maximum power output.


    Well, that's certainly an impressive feat of engineering... but we're not done yet.


    My friends, a picture is a thousand words, so here you go:



    Cut that main reactor in half, and you end up with a single-chamber reactor that only needs eight cooling towers and produces 800 EU/t like ths. Now build four of them. That's what you are seeing here. 3,200 EU/t per segment. Yes, my friends, per segment. This is completely vertically stackable, just like the Tower of Power.


    Of course, with great power comes great cost. None of these setups are cheap, the HV Transformers are expensive by themselves, and so many nuclear reactors and chambers won't be cheap either.


    However, you are looking at Efficiency 5 reactors with a truly enormous EU output, vertically scalable.


    I had a dream, and now my dream is fulfilled.


    The only fly in the ointment is automatically refilling of nuclear materials. It will try to flood it with cooling cells rather than nuclear material, unfortunately. So once every couple of hours, you will need to refill the nuclear material. However, it will at least automatically pull all of the depleted cells out for you. Meaning you can hook up a breeder reactor on the other side of the ME Network.


    My friends, I have only one thing to say: Mission Accomplished.

    I would say that that is over kill, but a side project im working on (not minecraft) tops that. great job though

    Quote from SirusKing

    Cool, but doesn't the AE network need a controller and power?


    I'm assuming the controller is elseware. the controller just needs to be in the network so this could be linked to your main system. as for power, it could be self sustaining

    Quote from SirusKing

    Cool, but doesn't the AE network need a controller and power?


    ME Cable runs underneath the sand to the Controller, which also has an attached ME Drive and a 1k disk with a number of spare 60k cells to provide an additional buffer.


    As far as power... I'm producing either 1600 EU/t from the first setup, or 3200 EU/t from the second. Providing power for the ME Network is not going to be difficult, I would imagine. :whistling:


    Mind you, these snapshots are of the 'demo' version. And, of course, they can always be improved upon. For example, I'm fairly certain I could tighten that ring at least one or two blocks if I put my mind to it. However, I believe it is sufficient 'proof of concept'.

    Quote from Blaster

    Challenge for you, can you make a breeder version?


    Easily!


    Breeder just uses one of several designs already present. Export bus to push depleted cells, import bus to pull out re-enriched cells. If the ME Network in question has access to autocrafting, then it becomes even more simple.


    Remember, we're working with ME Networks. The breeder doesn't need to be in the immediate vicinity, particularly not with the black holes and such you can create. As long as it is connected to the same ME Network, it can pull depleted cells right out of the inventory of the 1k memory card as fast as it produces re-enriched cells.

    • Official Post

    Looks like you have provided me with a long term goal :3
    Now, i need to figure out a way to turn the huge amount of steam it produces into energy.... How long on full blast does the GT Steam turbine with a Tungsteel blade last?

    I just realized something...


    This build is not only feasible but is actually more economical running with GregTech due to not needing all the DCP's for the quad cells, and it is fully capable of running with quad Plutonium cells, assuming you sufficiently expanded the number of cooling cells to be able to accommodate the additional heat generation. At that point, it would actually out-produce a Fusion Reactor.


    I... I feel like a man who has just broken the laws of thermodynamics. Part of me is standing in awe, and part of me feels dirty... as though I have somehow blasphemed against the very laws which govern reality by creating something which should not be, wondering of some lovecraftian horror inspired the creation for the purpose of bringing it into this reality to bring about its end.


    Part of me hopes that someone will disprove me, that I made an error somewhere and it doesn't actually do what I have seen it do, that I am merely acting on insufficient datum and a more mature reflection will provide some flaw inherent in my design... and part of me is afraid they will merely confirm it...


    Maybe... maybe I need to stop. Before I start wondering about the song of the endermen, wondering if there is meaning behind the static, and what that meaning might be...

    This, Mr Shneekey, is utterly ridiculous. That's why I love it :D


    Unfortunately, whenever I tried to get a CRCs system to work with AE, it never worked - the fuzzy buses kept ignoring the cooling cell damage values. You've apparently avoided that problem. I managed to get an ultra-powerful reactor going, but I'm using condensators instead, fed by lapis bees. I'd prefer to use CRCS, but this is less hassle to set up.


    Also: as you said, plutonium is amazing now. Not only does it have reduced heat from before (its exactly double that of uranium, which makes sense), you also get way more depleted cells - you get around 1.5 per plutonium cell, which is more than uranium.

    Quote from Shakie666

    This, Mr Shneekey, is utterly ridiculous. That's why I love it :D


    Unfortunately, whenever I tried to get a CRCs system to work with AE, it never worked - the fuzzy buses kept ignoring the cooling cell damage values. You've apparently avoided that problem. I managed to get an ultra-powerful reactor going, but I'm using condensators instead, fed by lapis bees. I'd prefer to use CRCS, but this is less hassle to set up.


    The secret is AE v12b. It permits fuzzy buses to recognize damage values of greater than or less than a particular percentage, dependent on where the item in question is in relation to that percentage.


    For example, if I set the fuzzy import bus to 25% and put in a cooling cell with LESS THAN 25%, then anything less than 25% left will automatically get pulled out.


    This is not functioning properly in versions prior to 12b, but seems to be fixed in this version.

    Quote from ShneekeyTheLost

    The secret is AE v12b. It permits fuzzy buses to recognize damage values of greater than or less than a particular percentage, dependent on where the item in question is in relation to that percentage.


    For example, if I set the fuzzy import bus to 25% and put in a cooling cell with LESS THAN 25%, then anything less than 25% left will automatically get pulled out.


    This is not functioning properly in versions prior to 12b, but seems to be fixed in this version.

    I see. Well then, I guess a CRCS ultra-power thingy will be a priority when my modpack gets updated.


    I think the largest problem with your design is that you need to manually insert new uranium cells every few hours.
    However, I have a fix: Factorization Routers. I guess inventory turtles could do it as well, but I don't know LUA, so that's a bit out of the question for me.


    You'll need a total of 18 routers per tower of production reactors- each of which will need a machine filter upgrade. Painful, considering that each filter requires logic matrix takes 20 minutes to crystallize. Note that you can use lines of furnaces to connect the different towers. You'll probably want a Speed upgrade for each as well, but the other upgrades are probably not necessary.


    For large towers, this could actually be a significant reduction in cost- as you're completely eliminating the busses that insert coolant into the reactors.


    Organize your routers in-world into groups of nine. Make sure that routers in the same group share at least one face with another router in the same group (lines and squares work well), but don't touch routers in the other group.


    Connect an ME Precision Export Bus to one router in each group. Have one bus export quad uranium cells, and have the other export fully-cooled coolant cells.
    Configure each of these two routers to insert into nearby Item Routers. As a tip, the router is always the last machine listed in the Machine Filter GUI- so just right-click the "all machines in network" button to get it.


    Configure the other 16 routers to insert items into all nuclear reactors in the network. But, you need them to only insert into a different specific slot- this is where things get a little more complicated.


    Right-click the bottom button on the initial GUI page (the button that says "into South sides" or something similar) until it reads "into slot 0". Do this for all 16 routers.


    I'll start with the coolant-inserting routers. It doesn't matter what order you do the following, just that each router has a unique slot. Note that, in addition to clicking the plus and minus buttons, you can type numbers into the router directly, while your mouse cursor is hovering over the button.
    Leave the first router at slot zero.
    Set the second router to slot 3.
    Set the third router to slot 9.
    Set the fourth router to slot 12.
    Set the fifth router to slot 36.
    Set the sixth router to slot 39.
    Set the seventh router to slot 45.
    And, last but not least, set the eighth router to slot 48.


    Do the same on the eight uranium-distributing routers, but set one router to each of slots 1, 2, 10, 11, 37, 38, 46, and 47.


    Now, this system will be a little slower about distributing coolant cells. Which could lead to any one of a variety of problems, including missing heat vents, fires, hunger debuffs, or craters. However, I have a solution to this, as well, using yet another mod in place of MFR: Buildcraft 3.


    Instead of running a line of RedNet cables along the column of reactors, run a line of pipes of any sort. Personally, I would use Cobblestone Structure Pipes, but others could work as well.
    Along the whole length of the pipes, frol the farthest reactor to your on/off switch, run some Red Pipe Wire.
    On each block of pipe that touches a reactor, place an Iron And Gate. Configure each gate to "Inventory Full" >> "Redstone Signal" and "Red Pipe Signal On" >> "Redstone Signal".
    The mod GateCopy (included in FTB Unleashed, for your information) is very handy here.


    On the pipe adjacent to your power switch, place a gate configured to "Redstone Signal On" >> Red Pipe Signal.


    As a final note, the cooling can be very easily managed using a pair of routers. You'll need two machine filters, an item filter, a couple speed upgrades, and an Ejector upgrade.
    Have your Fuzzy Export Bus inject spent coolant cells into a router with just a machine filter and a speed uprgade, configured to insert items into all nukes in the network. Also make sure that no blocks with inventory slots (ME busses and cables don't count; nukes, chests, routers, and furnaces do) connect the cooling towers to the main production towers.


    Have the other router (with all four aforementioned upgrades) extract fully cooled coolant cells from the nukes (the item filter acts like a Precise Bus), and eject them into an ME Interface. I wouldn't use a bus here- the Interface will instantly deal with any items pumped into it, while no import bus can pull more than a few non-stackable items per second.


    Edit: Testing indicates that my cooling tower design is virtually incapable of eliminating the last 30 heat or so. Thus, forget all my comments about using routers to pull cooled cells and using precise busses for fully cooled cells. Use a fuzzy bus on each coolant tower to pull cells that are more than 75% cooled, and use another to put them into the routers for distribution into the production reactors.

    If you stare at my avatar hard enough, you'll notice that it consists of three triangular rings, interlocked in such a way that if you were to remove any one of them, the other two would be free to float apart.

    Edited once, last by Someone Else 37: Added new information ().

    Schneekey, you are insane :p


    The one "flaw" I can see in this design is that most people who play normally will never have enough uranium/plutonium to run even one section of this, much less an entire tower. It just needs so much fuel.

    Quote from Omicron

    Schneekey, you are insane :p


    The one "flaw" I can see in this design is that most people who play normally will never have enough uranium/plutonium to run even one section of this, much less an entire tower. It just needs so much fuel.

    First part I can agree...


    But assuming Gregtech is not used you can breed uranium to multiply it by almost 8x. (or if you have set the setting in config)


    Each layer of the latter desing needs 32 Quads which is 128 Uranium cells which is only 16 Uranium. (every couple of hours)


    And if gregtech is used you should make use of the plutonium since it's a byproduct of processing uranium. (either by using dual cells or by doubling the cooling.)


    Ofcourse if you are using breeders you need quite a few of them too...atleast one per layer or something along those lines.

    Quote from Omicron

    Schneekey, you are insane :p


    The one "flaw" I can see in this design is that most people who play normally will never have enough uranium/plutonium to run even one section of this, much less an entire tower. It just needs so much fuel.


    When you stare into the End... the End stares back into you...


    I had an idea about Extra Bees having a bee which produces Uranium. This might be of relevance here.


    And the biggest flaw is not being able to load the nuclear material automatically because it is too busy loading the cooling cells.


    As far as Factorization... I've never gotten Routers to work properly with multi-chamber reactors, and they're too buggy for me to take seriously.


    Also, someone pointed out a wonderful little tweak... I had forgotten that you can paint glass fibre cable. So you can alternate colors on the glass fibre cables so you don't generate any power loops or anything and can stack the 3200EU/t version with no gaps between. The center square is an unpainted cable that runs to... whatever the hell you need this much power for. This means you can very easily (although the costs are going to be about the same) exceed the power generation of a Fusion Reactor for the same footprint.


    Also, as the creator of the cooling tower design I am using pointed out... that last half percent has trouble clearing, so you will need to use fuzzy import buses set to pull cooling cells at 99%. It's the last 30 heat or so that has the problem,and 1% of 60,000 is still 600, so you should be quite good there.

    You know, even though this is a great design and everything, it bugs me that it only has an efficiency of 5. Isn't it possible to squeeze some neutron reflectors in there to make it 6?

    Quote from Shakie666

    You know, even though this is a great design and everything, it bugs me that it only has an efficiency of 5. Isn't it possible to squeeze some neutron reflectors in there to make it 6?


    You certainly could do something like this, but neutronreflectors are expensive- GT's iridium reflectors hideously so; and the basic ones incur an additional running cost, which could end up decreasing the overall efficiency if you replace them using UU-matter.


    Additionally, with more power comes more heat- the design I linked produces a whopping 2688 heat per second, which would require 11.2 of my 2-chamber cooling towers at the very dangerous minimum to keep running. That's also 22.4 coolers if running plutonium in the latest versions of GregTech, according to Omicron's data [read: if Greg didn't change it again without saying anything].


    As a side note, I'm currently learning LUA so I can program an inventory turtle to repopulate the production reactors with uranium cells, after AE goes and fills them in entirely with coolant cells. Because using eighteen routers to manage far more nukes than anyone would ever be able to use is ridiculous.

    If you stare at my avatar hard enough, you'll notice that it consists of three triangular rings, interlocked in such a way that if you were to remove any one of them, the other two would be free to float apart.

    Quote from Shakie666

    You know, even though this is a great design and everything, it bugs me that it only has an efficiency of 5. Isn't it possible to squeeze some neutron reflectors in there to make it 6?


    Oh sure, that's exceedingly easy, I just don't because NR's are a huge honkin' trap. But hey, if you want NR's, you can try something like my pocket DDoS reactor that Someone Else 37 linked for you. You can also use the full-sized one here. Just remember that NR's need replacing if they aren't the irridium plates, which are stupidly expensive.


    Now, you've got a micro-cycle time of 179 and a cooling cycle of 500 seconds, meaning you've got around 2.8 micro-cycles per cycle. Since you DO NOT want to use fractional cycles, we'll call that three per. So you've got 16 cooling cells, and each tower can accommodate two towers, so you're looking at 8 * 3 = 24 cooling towers. Of course, you're also looking at 1920 EU/t and an efficiency of 6. I'm not sure it is worth the trade-off, since you'll be needing to replace all those NR's periodically, which will REALLY eat into your efficiency rating.

    I wonder if the latest version of Logistics Pipes can assist. Set up a Supplier Pipe to keep x 60k cooling cells and y nuclear material. As long as you don't have nuclear material and cooling cells pulled at the same time, it shouldn't get its wires crossed, although it is something of a risk I suppose. I believe LP can sent requests through an ME Network.