Suggestion: New GeoGen system.

  • YES! SO MUCH WIN! If this gets implemented, I know where my new t2 source of power will be: Geothermal gens :D

  • First off, I'm loving this discussion of geos. From day one of IC I have always loved Geothermals. Pouring lava in and getting a hum of energy has always been nice. Now, if implemented, this new geo has taken the next step, a bit like the nuclear reactors. I believe I would enjoy a geothermal that worked as described in this thread.



    -just my 2 cents.

    I5 2500K | 4GB Cosair Vengence | Radeon 6850 | Rosewill 600w PSU | GigaByte Z68MA | CM Elite 311 | Dell 19" 720p (upgrading soon!)| Hitachi 500 GB 7200 HDD | LG 24X |Windows 7 (Genuine!)
    Alblaka in a Lightning Rod suggestion thread...[/size]

  • First off, I'm loving this discussion of geos. From day one of IC I have always loved Geothermals. Pouring lava in and getting a hum of energy has always been nice. Now, if implemented, this new geo has taken the next step, a bit like the nuclear reactors. I believe I would enjoy a geothermal that worked as described in this thread.

    Thanks! ^^


    I really want to see that GeoGen system in mod (in game) too.

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|

  • I love where this is going. It's basically turned into the Mark 0 nuclear reactor. On that note, it would be cool to have a tradeoff for maximum power/time, much like the reactor is. So you can have a Geo that produces massive eu/s but has to be heavily babysitted, or, on the complete opposite side of the scale, one that produces very little, but will run for ages. Just a thought. :)

  • How would you integrate the miner and pump into such a system? They really shouldnt be ignored since they are an integral part of a real geothermal system.

  • How would you integrate the miner and pump into such a system? They really shouldnt be ignored since they are an integral part of a real geothermal system.

    The pump is already included, as it can be used to fill water cells (currently bugged, but fixed for 1.0). The miner, I'm not so sure about, as the pump will eventually pump lava too iirc.

  • The pump is already included, as it can be used to fill water cells (currently bugged, but fixed for 1.0). The miner, I'm not so sure about, as the pump will eventually pump lava too iirc.

    Why not let them act as additional chambers one on each side of the geo gen (kinda like how the miner in IC auto supplied the geo gen with lava). If the pump is present then then the lava and/or water that it is pumping will automatically be pumped in and only use the the cells inside the gen as a recipe. Using a high powered geo gen recipe that has minimal coolant cells will still eat through coolant cell so it wont be completely automatic unless you go the safest route with low EU production. Though I don't think there should be any explosions if the geo gen overheats. Maybe the geo gen just turns into lava.

    All people dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
    the dusty recesses of their mind, wake in the morning to find
    that it was vanity. But the dreamers of the day are dangerous people,
    for they dream their dreams with open eyes, and make them come true.
    --T.E. Lawrence

  • Why not let them act as additional chambers one on each side of the geo gen (kinda like how the miner in IC auto supplied the geo gen with lava). If the pump is present then then the lava and/or water that it is pumping will automatically be pumped in and only use the the cells inside the gen as a recipe. Using a high powered geo gen recipe that has minimal coolant cells will still eat through coolant cell so it wont be completely automatic unless you go the safest route with low EU production. Though I don't think there should be any explosions if the geo gen overheats. Maybe the geo gen just turns into lava.

    If GeoGen will be able to take Water Cells from Pump and Lava Cells from chest near the Autominer (if AutM will be able to fill Cells with lava, not buckets).. then it will fork fine only with Tier 3 GeoGens (where you have 3 L-Cells and W-Cells).


    "unless you go the safest route with low EU production" - I think you don't get my post clear.


    One Water Cell in GeoGen always generate "N" value of EU/t. No matter how many Coolant Cell you got or Lava Cells (but at least one Lava Cell will be needed for GeoGen to work).


    If you will set 3 Water Cells and only one Lava Cell, it will give you "N"x3 EU/t, but in that case Lava Cell will cool off extremely fast (too much water for one Lava Cell).


    My point is:


    With the GeoGens you shouldn't care of the heat produsing or explosion chance, no.
    You must set a BALANCED combination of Lava and Water Cells and all.


    And as I told before, balanced combinations is where number of the Water Cells = number of the Coolant Cells.


    And I want that losses cuz of broking that balance will be epicly high with each unnecessary or missing cell.
    Example: (in all cases are no Coolant Cells, they not matter in this example, just will multiply)


    • 1W + 1L - Oh, it's ok. Work fine and a long time "T" and giving me "N" EU/t. (same 2W + 2L ("N"x2) and 3W + 3L ("N"x3))
    • 1W + 2L - Hmmm.. Not good, too much lava, working too fast, just 1/3 of time "T", but giving me "N" EU/t. (same or almost same 2W + 3L ("N"x2))
    • 1W + 3L - OH MY GODNESS! It ended so quickly, just 1/12 of optimal time "T",.. but still giving me "N" EU/t.
    • 2W + 1L - Eh.. need more lava, it gives me "N"x2 EU/t, but only 1/3 of normal time "T". (same or almost same 3W+2L ("N"x3))
    • 3W + 1L - Ah, yep. Too much water, lava was cooled so fast, it was giving me "N"x3, but only that ridiculous 1/12 of normal time "T", next time will use more Lava Cells.

    So you see? Than more you close to the "ideal balance" than more time will work GeoGen with the same resources => more EU.
    Your goal is to get it to wark longer. So what for Coolant Cells are:


    One Coolant Cell with "balanced W-L" will work perfectly and double it's working time ("T"x2), 2 C-Cells = "T"x3, 3 C-Cells = "T"x4.
    BUT. With bad (not balanced) GeoGens wouldn't work fine, and will just add a half of current "T" (unbalanced = 1/3"T"+1/6"T", more unbalanced = 1/12"T" + 1/24"T"), it's ridiculous, right? Too low uprgade per Coolant Cell with unbalanced GeoGens. Yes.
    Cuz BALANCE IS YOUR ALL ! :D :thumbsup: :D

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|

  • Goethermal gens with sophistication of Nuclear Reactors....YES PLEASE!! I am begging you on my knees Alblaka, please implement this :D

  • I actually am starting to like this idea. Fact is, neither geothermal, nor conventional generators can work on heat alone. You need some working body. Namely, water. Creating generator designs that utilize the heat of the fuel to the fullest is a great idea. This way, the energy values for different items can be increased without compromising balance - simply make those more powerful energy sources require more management - more water, more space in the "generator grid" (which can be between 3x3 to 5x5 depending on the tier of the reactor).

  • Fact is, neither geothermal, nor conventional generators can work on heat alone. You need some working body. Namely, water.

    Fact is you don't need water. Heat alone is enough if you use air as the working fluid. I m not saying it is efficient (though that could be due to lack of research in the field and since modern technology has never been used to design a serious one... we went to oil powered engines and never looked back to anything else...) See Stirling engine for more info:


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirling_engine


    An actual sterling generator that was produced in the 1960s or so: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9UKu-AP02k

    All people dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
    the dusty recesses of their mind, wake in the morning to find
    that it was vanity. But the dreamers of the day are dangerous people,
    for they dream their dreams with open eyes, and make them come true.
    --T.E. Lawrence

  • Oh, alright, there exist engines which work on gaseous fluids. But the point is, Geothermal generators don't. In real life, all geothermal generators utilize the power of the steam heated up by the geothermal process to work the turbines. That's just how it is.

  • Oh, alright, there exist engines which work on gaseous fluids. But the point is, Geothermal generators don't. In real life, all geothermal generators utilize the power of the steam heated up by the geothermal process to work the turbines. That's just how it is.

    Ya well in real life we also don't go find the nearest source of lava, grab a bucket of it, and then bring it back to our house to generate electricity. In fact I don't think lava is even used. It is just the heat of the earth next to thermally active regions that heat the water that is then pumped back up the surface. Which means if these were real geothermal generators they which just have to pumps one to pump water down a deep well and one two pump water up from a deep well along with being extremely expensive to make. Though I have no problem fudging a couple facts for a better gameplay experience.

    All people dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
    the dusty recesses of their mind, wake in the morning to find
    that it was vanity. But the dreamers of the day are dangerous people,
    for they dream their dreams with open eyes, and make them come true.
    --T.E. Lawrence

  • Ya well in real life we also don't go find the nearest source of lava, grab a bucket of it, and then bring it back to our house to generate electricity. In fact I don't think lava is even used. It is just the heat of the earth next to thermally active regions that heat the water that is then pumped back up the surface. Which means if these were real geothermal generators they which just have to pumps one to pump water down a deep well and one two pump water up from a deep well along with being extremely expensive to make. Though I have no problem fudging a couple facts for a better gameplay experience.

    So..?


    In my (crazy) imagination, geothermal station comes in that way (in GeoGen):


    "The heat of the earth" is realised in Lava Cells. (cuz in MC lava is hot 4ever unless meet water, and that becouse Lava Cells lose their..charge)


    "hot steam / extremely pressured hot water" is realised in Water Cells. (turns into hot steam by contacting Lava Cells)


    "in RL hot steam/water from "the bowels of the earth" just comes to the surface and.. all." No circulating, but we need it! Cuz we don't need just single process, we need continual work of GeoGen for constant EU/t. Thats why appears the Coolant Cells. We can make some looped tube and fill it with hot steam (Water Cells + Lava Cells = hot steam, right?). Yes, process will start, steam will be heated in 1 place (when near the Lava Cells) and cooled off at other way in tubes of GeoGen. BUT, as I say before (and in OP), without additional cooling hot steam will be heated and heated again and again each time when comind near Lava Sector of GeoGen. Overheated steam just will automatically get off from the GeoGen, and in that case water from Water Cell/Cells will.. end very fast. But not with the Coolant Cells.


    Now you get it? :)


    And guys.. wtf?! This is MineCraft, where creepers and.. unlimited water, crazy blocks gravity and etc... And this is Industrial Craft, where Matter Generators, imba Lasers, nanosiut... Relax! :thumbup:

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|

  • Edited OP again.


    So.. what do administration think about that suggestion?

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|

  • Alblaka?.. Guys?
    Tell something please, what do you think?
    + or - :huh:

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|

  • We probably wont hear anything for a while, maybe not even until its implemented if they do. xD

    Eh.. maybe.

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|

  • So what do IC2 team think? :huh:

    Yep, I am from Russia, and yep, my english isn't good enough...
    So if.. if you dare to laugh of me, I.. I will find you and destroy with all our Soviet nuclear bombs, bwahahaha!
    Naah, I'm just kidding ^^ ... not. :|


  • Electric generators run on the principle, as you said, of converting mechanical energy into electrical energy. This is done with dynamos/alternators which are very much similar to electric motors. The difference is which end provides power and a few mechanical things that can be glossed over for the sake of building (differences in using AC vs DC). These things could be added to our list of components to build things out of and could be made cheaply. We could use the motors in other things like our drills, chainsaws, automated miners, macerators, pumps, etc. instead of electronic circuits.


    For example, we make an electric motor from insulated copper wire and a single ingot of iron.
    Wire, iRon
    WWW
    WRW
    WWW


    Then build some means to provide mechanical energy such as a turbine. Since tin is a catch-all for metal usage we'll probably just make it out of that, but in reality it's not very strong, and Iron seems to be to important to waste material. I don't want to use wood in a nuclear reactor do you? We could make it out of bronze, there isn't too much use for it yet and real bronze is used in applications requiring resistance to corrosion, but making bronze requires machines to do so (in my opinion bronze should be more accessible since it was in wide use before iron was made)


    So we could have something like this for a turbine:
    Bronze, _: Empty
    B_B
    _B_
    B_B


    These can be combined to make a single dynamo item, then added to a furnace and a rechargeable battery in place of the machine block to make the furnace generator we all start out with:
    Rebattery, Dynamo, Furnace _: Space
    _R_
    _D_
    _F_


    Since what I think Alblaka was going for in our solar panels was a photovoltaic source of electricity and not a solar heater, (the latter requires a generator and the former, photovoltaic cells) I think we should eschew the generator block and put a rechargeable battery in there. To make up for the material cost cost, I propose we have a craft tree for making photovoltaic cells and arrays out of glass since in real life they are made of crystalline silicon and glass. Pure silicon is made by reacting silicon dioxide (glass) with carbon (charcoal/coal) in a furnace, but we could just stuff a bunch of glass into a compressor and say it's turning it into silicon wafers. We can layer 6 wafers with 3 glass to make 1 photovoltaic cell like so:
    Silicon Wafer, Glass
    SSS
    GGG
    SSS

    and combine 9 cells into 1 array:
    Photovoltaic Cell
    CCC
    CCC
    CCC

    Then build a solar panel like this:
    Glass,Photovoltaic Array, Copper Cable, Rebattery
    GGG
    AAA
    CRC

    In addition we have silicon to make electric circuits out of instead of our precious refined iron.