But seriously, who of the MCForge guys would now run after BTW, checking it's releases to include the hooks after BTW complained about MCForge like that?
I would.
IC2 Mod compatability
- napalmeddie
- Closed
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I think you may have misunderstood the intent of the question. Take it to mean "Why would anyone in Forge make the effort of ensuring Forge compatibility with a mod that desires to be no longer compatible?"
As I said before, this will go from "no guarantee of compatibility" to "guaranteed incompatibility" in short order, as FC begins to use block IDs that are occupied by other mods and makes more significant changes.
It's absurd to think that anyone will make more effort to ensure BTW compatibility than FC would himself.
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I think you may have misunderstood the intent of the question. Take it to mean "Why would anyone in Forge make the effort of ensuring Forge compatibility with a mod that desires to be no longer compatible?"
As I said before, this will go from "no guarantee of compatibility" to "guaranteed incompatibility" in short order, as FC begins to use block IDs that are occupied by other mods and makes more significant changes.
It's absurd to think that anyone will make more effort to ensure BTW compatibility than FC would himself.
less of an issue about Block IDs (they can always be moved) than FC making base class changes to accomplish what he wants to do, thus causing conflicts with the Forge. There's a reason the Aether mod is stuck in 1.7.3, they did *lots* of base class changes and just couldn't get things updated or at least that's how i've read and am understanding it.
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Definitely, glad you you guys were able to talk and clear things up from the sounds of it you pretty much affirmed with her what i was saying, that there will be some overlap but considering the fact that you are both very different people I can't imagine both mods ever having -everything- from one mod found in the other. Especially since you have a head start and continue to roll out awesome additions.
On a far more general note it's pretty much a given that any idea no matter how perfect or awesome it is, is going to be taken and done in a new and interesting way by another. To quote T.S. Elliot
QuoteOne of the surest tests [of the superiority or inferiority of a poet] is the way in which a poet borrows. Immature poets imitate; mature poets steal; bad poets deface what they take, and good poets make it into something better, or at least something different. The good poet welds his theft into a whole of feeling which is unique, utterly different than that from which it is torn; the bad poet throws it into something which has no cohesion.
Which I would actually attribute to the whole of creative endeavors rather then just poetry, the thought that just because an idea is already out there doesn't mean it should never be touched. There should always be room for the reimagining of ideas, so long as the artist is good at what they do the original will always still have it's own place since nothing else will ever be identical. -
[less of an issue about Block IDs (they can always be moved) than FC making base class changes to accomplish what he wants to do, thus causing conflicts with the Forge. There's a reason the Aether mod is stuck in 1.7.3, they did *lots* of base class changes and just couldn't get things updated or at least that's how i've read and am understanding it.
True - but I've heard that FC kind of runs his block IDs right through the middle of IC's range. I had to reassign a few IDs from IC add-ons when I installed Forestry, but it's one thing to change 4, and anoter when we're talking as many as BTW might use.But yeah, it's the other changes - the ones the end-user cannot easily adjust - that are the real pain.
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less of an issue about Block IDs (they can always be moved) than FC making base class changes to accomplish what he wants to do, thus causing conflicts with the Forge. There's a reason the Aether mod is stuck in 1.7.3, they did *lots* of base class changes and just couldn't get things updated or at least that's how i've read and am understanding it.
It just means that they are too incompetent to not use basefile changes... There are better ways to do it that use much fewer changes to the basefiles. If you don't know what I am talking about, then learn to code java. Or google it.
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It just means that they are too incompetent to not use basefile changes... There are better ways to do it that use much fewer changes to the basefiles. If you don't know what I am talking about, then learn to code java. Or google it.
Just like there's a way to provide a constant, unchanging API with Java but Mojang isn't going there.... their idea of a "Modding API" is just source access... not really what i'd call an API. -
Just like there's a way to provide a constant, unchanging API with Java but Mojang isn't going there.... their idea of a "Modding API" is just source access... not really what i'd call an API.No offense, but you obviously don't know much about java programming. I will give you accessing another class in a nutshell. You can set classes and methods as public or private. You can access those methods from another class using some code that I am not going to explain here. Now, if they put all of their code inside of their own classes, they can set up "links" to the base classes and their methods. This would make compatibility issues easier to solve, and updating easier and less time consuming.
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No offense, but you obviously don't know much about java programming. I will give you accessing another class in a nutshell. You can set classes and methods as public or private. You can access those methods from another class using some code that I am not going to explain here. Now, if they put all of their code inside of their own classes, they can set up "links" to the base classes and their methods. This would make compatibility issues easier to solve, and updating easier and less time consuming.
Other way around, buddy.. that came straight from my brother, the guy with a Masters degree and a job doing Java programming. I just forgot the exact terms. There *is* a way to provide an unchanging API. -
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Other way around, buddy.. that came straight from my brother, the guy with a Masters degree and a job doing Java programming. I just forgot the exact terms. There *is* a way to provide an unchanging API.That's exactly what forge is. The hooks they refer to are forge exposing the properties and methods of the base classes through a public interface. Jens already mentioned in a tweet he's talking to forge devs and a couple of others in January to make the modding API a priority. I think the estimate on first release was around March.
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I think the estimate on first release was around March.
He said, noone should exspect any release as soon as March.Which translates into:
"DONT HYPE, it will take LONG to develope the API. In a perfect situation, which will not occur, the releas could be scheduled for March". -
He said, noone should exspect any release as soon as March.Which translates into:
"DONT HYPE, it will take LONG to develope the API. In a perfect situation, which will not occur, the releas could be scheduled for March".I figured march would be an Alpha release (if it happens in march). But you're right, these things never go as planned so no one should be setting any timeframes by them.
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Enforced incompatibility is a disservice to your fans and players. Basically, you force them to choose, one or the other. I've illustrated how I act when put to that extreme - I'd hate to have to choose between two mods I love.
As long as the two of you work together, fans don't have to choose and can use both. Don't make FC's mistake and let ego get in the way of making something people want to use.I highly agree with you - if ic2 purposely blocks rp2 or another mod - you are acting just like FlowerChild. SO what she is making similar things, are you afraid RP2 will make IC obsolete? I highly doubt that...i would not play this game if it werent for IC RP, and BC. In that order. ANd if i can tget these 3 working(only because theres personal issues with the developers) i will drop minecraft and i feel alot of other fans will too. This is B.S.!! IC is a damn good mod you guys are some smart ass coders, and so is Eloraam, but i feel like theres a bit of jealousy or envy goin on...idk, lets drop all this and you head-coders get together and come to some agreements and lay down your long term goals
"Sure, RP is bringing in electrical generation and wiring but BC/IC also has it's own overlap in that department yet I hear no suggestions of hooks to make IC and BC incompatible."
Ya, and thats why i mentioned maybe a lil jealousy or envy because i dont understand why just RP..BC & IC2 have some similar functions as well
I dont feel she made mods intentially to make other mods obsolete, its obvious she wanted to make these mods at some time ago. Not everyone use IC2 and/or BC((which i feel are for more adv users) but if they use just RP(imo is not too advanced but very well coded and necessity to MC) then they still have a lil bit of everything(depending on what she does)I really hope Albaka doesnt block RP in the future regardless of what it evolves into or any other mod for that sake. Please, think of the fans. And it's never that serious. Guys are acting like this is a competition, dont forget "why" you started making mods. If my words offended anyone or im taking the wrong way i apologize, please dont ban me...Im a New Yorker..we come of the wrong way sometimes.
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I really hope Albaka doesnt block RP in the future regardless of what it evolves into or any other mod for that sake.
You should read the blog or AT LEAST the posts following up on something you want to comment. -
You should read the blog or AT LEAST the posts following up on something you want to comment.Sorry i got so amped after reading 2 pages i skipped to go comment, now i came back to edit/take some words back and your here?! Sheesh its been 2 minutes gimme a break hahaa - but nice you guys cleared that up like Headhunters and other member's words was on the money and i kno they pushed you towards settling this. Sorry i just put together a big modpack with IC2,BC, and RP leading it, and i read this like wth, i need these 3 mods over anything. Also im loving the luminators now, i can actually stop using her rp lights(which i felt was unrealistic) and put real electricity to light up my house!!! I LOVE YOU guys, no homo tho
On a sidenote, Wiki needs updating for new items recipes latpack, splitter cables etc
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On a sidenote, Wiki needs updating for new items recipes latpack, splitter cables etc
Feel free to do so, wiki's are based on their users activity. -
[005] Q&A session with FlowerChild, about the Forge and Better than Wolves
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Regarding RP2 only reason i started using RP was because of the redstone stacking into 1 cable and the ability to create multiple different connections through one cable and make it stick to the wall and celing. But now it has become so much i dont want or need.
However BC and IC2 i love, and when IC2 gets to MC1.0+ ill resume using it.
But im always looking for a replacement for RP because i only want the wiring of redstone and wish that i could wire
energy from ic2 the same way.
But im 100% Buildcraft and Industrialcraft^2 but "forced" to use RP2 because of space limitations on my creations.
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Regarding RP2 only reason i started using RP was because of the redstone stacking into 1 cable and the ability to create multiple different connections through one cable and make it stick to the wall and celing. But now it has become so much i dont want or need.
However BC and IC2 i love, and when IC2 gets to MC1.0+ ill resume using it.
But im always looking for a replacement for RP because i only want the wiring of redstone and wish that i could wire
energy from ic2 the same way.
But im 100% Buildcraft and Industrialcraft^2 but "forced" to use RP2 because of space limitations on my creations.
Psst: you don't *have to* install all of RP2, it's very modular.
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Psst: you don't *have to* install all of RP2, it's very modular.
It's not as modular as you might think. some stuff depends on other stuff being there.
As to Eloraam's behavior. This is something that has bugged me a bit. She made a choice. She could have continued to make mods for other mods and made her own stuff depend on those mods but it raises issues of dealing with other peoples release cycles. None the less that is the way to approach duplication. Not what she has done. If BC/IC/RP were collapsed into one and everyone followed the same API and had the same path do you know how epic that would be. It would basically make the game that most of us want to be playing already. You know the one that takes energy management/resource management with a dash of hardcore automation and makes it fun. instead Elo is just going off to do whatever she wants and doesn't seem terribly concerned with who she steps on.
Sadly this is going to end up bad for everyone involved. Don't get me wrong I love her mod but there was no need for pipes. You can do everything her pipes do with BC pipes and mods (some are still alpha). There was no need for bluetricity. she could have just used IC2. Some of the machines are cool but don't bother trying to convince me that bluetricity and tubes were needed. And she does not offer or even imply that you ever be able to mod her stuff the same way IC and BC have allowed.
That kind of closed source never works out well in the end for anyone but the person doing the writing.
