Making solars less OP

  • Everything in minecraft its infinite.

    A few Arguments against that:


    Only 3 Strongholds (maximum), so FINITE Moss/Crackbricks and FINITE Endportals
    Only 1 Enderdragon, so FINITE Enderdragoneggs
    Only 1 Island in the End (never found a second), so FINITE Endstone
    Only an Area, which is quadruple as large as the Earth, so FINITE (but a pretty large amount) everything, what is nonrenewable.


    I just wanted to be a bit more exact, did i forgot something?

  • A few Arguments against that:


    Only 3 Strongholds (maximum), so FINITE Moss/Crackbricks and FINITE Endportals
    Only 1 Enderdragon, so FINITE Enderdragoneggs
    Only 1 Island in the End (never found a second), so FINITE Endstone
    Only an Area, which is quadruple as large as the Earth, so FINITE (but a pretty large amount) everything, what is nonrenewable.


    I just wanted to be a bit more exact, did i forgot something?

    You mean X and Z when above or lower than about 14.000.000 starts bugging terrain generation and becomes unplayable? [Far lands]
    With forestry moss stone is not finite. With IC, some natural resources are renewable.
    Mobspawners are also finite.
    Cobwebs are also finite.
    Chain armor is finite [we cant even get it]


  • Renewable : you can make\produce it on surface [Except UUM stuff]
    Non renewable: you have to dig it


    Renewable: You can make the stuff over and over in the same chunk.
    Non-Renewable: You have to move to a diferent chunk when the one you are in its exhausted of its resources.


    A few Arguments against that:


    Only 3 Strongholds (maximum), so FINITE Moss/Crackbricks and FINITE Endportals
    Only 1 Enderdragon, so FINITE Enderdragoneggs
    Only 1 Island in the End (never found a second), so FINITE Endstone
    Only an Area, which is quadruple as large as the Earth, so FINITE (but a pretty large amount) everything, what is nonrenewable.


    I just wanted to be a bit more exact, did i forgot something?


    Besides from the moss/crackbricks. Do people use the rest of the stuff to the point they become exhausted?


    Dragon Egg its useless
    Endstone iirc gets destroyed when you try to harvest it
    The area is fucking big enough that its more likely you are going to start a new world instead of staying in the one you are in.

  • lol.
    Is it useful in anyway for this threads ? Some things are finite, some others no.
    The question is about GreenGen.
    If Solar panel could burn, should the normal gen be repaired because of the constant heat he used to produce energy ?
    Should GeoGen be washed after usage because of stone from cooled lava ?
    Should Fuel/Uranium make polution ?
    I think there's just some people who want it finite because they:
    -Don't know how to use it. (--> it's their problems)
    -Know how to use it, but think they could be more powerful and richer on their servs if it was finite. (same thing)
    -Find that producing Matter with Solar Pannel/Windmill is OP because of the fact that servers are always running, and GreenGen producing a lot of EU--> UU-Matter while people are AFK/not on the serv, and that makes IC² a bit like EE [I use this fact but I think it's a problem). (--> So just add a config option to avoid EU to be produced while nobody is on the server(I think it already do not count unloaded chunks, isn't it ?) But in Single Player, no PB with GreenGen.


    Soon with Molten Salt Reactors, right ? :D
    NERF THA FUSION REACTOR!

  • 1. You mean X and Z when above or lower than about 14.000.000 starts bugging terrain generation and becomes unplayable? [Far lands]
    2. With forestry moss stone is not finite. With IC, some natural resources are renewable.
    3. Mobspawners are also finite.
    4. Cobwebs are also finite.
    5. Chain armor is finite [we cant even get it]

    1. Yes indeed.
    2. Yes but they are RENEWABLE (with Massfab), what then doesn't applies to finite Worldgeneration.
    3. But they are generated all over the "Infinite" Map.
    4. Same as 3.
    5. Hmm we need UUM-Recipe for Fire, to put out Fires like FenixR (with Fire).


    And as i said i just wanted to be exact.

  • What all of this really boils down to is this:

    Quote

    Where do you get the audacity from to try and force everyone to play your way, when it's possible for you to enjoy yourself in your own way without imposing your will on others?

    ALL of the technology that we use in IC works as it is intended for within both real industry setting and Minecraft industry setting. They have their uses, flaws, and perks. The way they function in real life is used as a guildline to their design in this mod, and as such, function similar as intended by the devs. While we may use them in a game-like setting, their uses have serious importance in ALL of our lives.


    So to bicker and fight and flame and claw at each other over petty 'game balance' about 'wich gen is teh greatest' or 'wich gen iz too OP!' is honestly a waste of time and a foolish bargain of personal appeasement and blight. It's idiotic to argue over the ability to generate energy from the Sun, and to consider that the same function that a plant uses to grow to be 'too overpowered' to be brought into a game/simulation setting. It's also childish to assume that those with better scientific understanding of the world would agree with such arguments as the OPness of renewables, as we clearly understand their utility in more ways than one...



    I personally wish that it become a rule to ban anyone who starts a thread claiming 'X generator is OP or UP', much to the same manner that people who request updates are insta-banned. The ONLY response that the mod team should even have to make is that 'there is a config file, use it'.



    This childish game of 'game balance' claims needs to stop...

    Would anyone like to try a Slowpoke Tail?! Only 1 Million Yen!


    Quote

    this isn't about arrogance or ego, I have a block that I put a lot of freaking work into


    Every Mod Author, in existence. And yet, you STILL say otherwise.

  • I agree completely with you.

    i agree as well if some one wants to suggest a ballance tweek that doesn't add new and useful content to the mod they should take it up with their server admin and then the admin can can request support if he can't find an adequate solution.

    true balance is impossible in video games the best one can hope for is to make it really hard to guess which of 2 choices are better.
    and remember kids "NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF JOKES!"

  • I agree completely with you.

    This.
    The concept of nerfing various generators for various arbitrary reasons has already been beaten to death several times over and it is tiering to see it resurrected once again <_<
    They (all the generators) are quite good as they currently are.
    And yes, it is very much the admins problem to see to that his server doesn't lag, addons or not, rules or not.

  • Solar is not OP.


    This statement is coming from a guy who filled up the entire Personal Safe with UU-Matter with just three IC2 Nuclear Reactors (no BC / RP / etc.) within one week. I don't think Solar Panels can achieve that.

  • Solar is not OP.


    This statement is coming from a guy who filled up the entire Personal Safe with UU-Matter with just three IC2 Nuclear Reactors (no BC / RP / etc.) within one week. I don't think Solar Panels can achieve that.

    what part of "this childish debate needs to stop" DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND!?! the OP and all nerfers/buffers are probably aware that "take it up with your server admin" is the new social norm so you comments are not helping and they will only perpetuate this pointless debate to the point of flamewar

    true balance is impossible in video games the best one can hope for is to make it really hard to guess which of 2 choices are better.
    and remember kids "NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF JOKES!"

  • what part of "this childish debate needs to stop" DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND!?! the OP and all nerfers/buffers are probably aware that "take it up with your server admin" is the new social norm so you comments are not helping and they will only perpetuate this pointless debate to the point of flamewar


    Even if this thread is closed, the debate will most likely arise somewhere in the future. Until a middle ground is reached i doubt it will ever die. Anyway i agree this thread needs to be closed now.

  • Yeah,there surely IS something what is sure - everything needs maintaince.Solar panel (panel itself) gets dirty over time.Depending on their working mechanics,the need oil for cylinder,highest quality water,inside wire replacements..man,tons of everything.



    My idea is having different recepies for solar panels,like long unforgotten 2 copper cables and generator for basic/cheap/whatever you call it/ solar,then our modern recepie,and some *higher quality* solar. Maybe,each of them could produce slightly different eu/t.
    But the point is,having durability for machines,like for tools or having a *sure* working time and after that,possibility of breaking.It seems more-or-less realistic.
    Another idea is to add scheme of *insides* of a machine,where working parts of machine can be checked.So,if some thing break,you replace it and everything is ok.That seems even more realistic.

  • Yeah,there surely IS something what is sure - everything needs maintaince.Solar panel (panel itself) gets dirty over time.Depending on their working mechanics,the need oil for cylinder,highest quality water,inside wire replacements..man,tons of everything.



    My idea is having different recepies for solar panels,like long unforgotten 2 copper cables and generator for basic/cheap/whatever you call it/ solar,then our modern recepie,and some *higher quality* solar. Maybe,each of them could produce slightly different eu/t.
    But the point is,having durability for machines,like for tools or having a *sure* working time and after that,possibility of breaking.It seems more-or-less realistic.
    Another idea is to add scheme of *insides* of a machine,where working parts of machine can be checked.So,if some thing break,you replace it and everything is ok.That seems even more realistic.


    Well i guess if you are going to nerf one machine under the basis of "Maintenance" to keep everything realistic to captain realism, then every single machine in the game should also be affected by this. Tools and nano/quatum armor may or may not get something like this because its annoying to code something to keep track of when to maintain it and shit (Although according to alblaka, NBT Tags solves everything equipment related)

  • Well i guess if you are going to nerf one machine under the basis of "Maintenance" to keep everything realistic to captain realism, then every single machine in the game should also be affected by this. Tools and nano/quatum armor may or may not get something like this because its annoying to code something to keep track of when to maintain it and shit (Although according to alblaka, NBT Tags solves everything equipment related)

    Yeah,I have an off-scene dream of such realism,as it opens some new possibilities in smp and surely creates some pain in the ass in ssp /still,having a magic on-off option in config would be nice :D /.Yeah,this would make people build less same-type machines and make more upgrades,than more generators,etc.Pain in the ass could turn into something nice.Several new tools,brainkilling mechanics..sure,that's cool and fits 100% perfectly.I d love to see that 1 good day

  • Yeah,there surely IS something what is sure - everything needs maintaince.Solar panel (panel itself) gets dirty over time.Depending on their working mechanics,the need oil for cylinder,highest quality water,inside wire replacements..man,tons of everything.



    My idea is having different recepies for solar panels,like long unforgotten 2 copper cables and generator for basic/cheap/whatever you call it/ solar,then our modern recepie,and some *higher quality* solar. Maybe,each of them could produce slightly different eu/t.
    But the point is,having durability for machines,like for tools or having a *sure* working time and after that,possibility of breaking.It seems more-or-less realistic.
    Another idea is to add scheme of *insides* of a machine,where working parts of machine can be checked.So,if some thing break,you replace it and everything is ok.That seems even more realistic.

    is it to much to ask to go for a week with out some one having to throw in their repetitive 2 cents on this subject? we've been over this here are the magical shutdown arguments AGAIN


    1.THIS IS SPARTA MINECRAFT! this is a world of floating dirt, coal fired furnaces with no exhaust, and the ability to stuff server hundred cubic meters of stone in my jeans pocket NOTHING is for sure
    2. if realism is applied to green energy then it has to be applied to all energy therefore re-leveling the playing field and keeping solar "on top" as some would put it
    3. the user base is used to a certain level of convenience and fun if you want things to be harder play terrafirma craft
    4. if your proposing a nerf do to an experience you had in a smp environment take it up with your sever admin
    5. if your proposing a nerf do to an experience you had in a ssp environment then shut the hell up you can't tell me how to play

    true balance is impossible in video games the best one can hope for is to make it really hard to guess which of 2 choices are better.
    and remember kids "NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF JOKES!"

  • Just for your information, if you ask me to shut up politely or not simply because you are "Fed up" with the topic, i swear i will emerge from your PC monitor and do a Ozzy Osbourne on your head.


    This is a forum, we are in our right to express our opinion how we like it to, even if its on a annoying topic such as this. As long as it doesn't break any rules of the forum. As long as someone have something to say about the matter, they are in their right to do so.


    And for the record i always consider that one should make a suggestion with the mindset of convincing solely the dev team that its something worth to do it. If other people follow then fine, if not then defend your suggestion with all that you have so it doesn't get stomped (Like i so much like to do :D). For a reason its a forum that people can discuss stuff in, it would make no sense to have a one side discussion otherwise...


    Oh, and the part about not wanting someone to tell you how to play can be applied the other way too, the other side would like to play the game in a different way beyond some number tweaking only, and the only way to do so is by convincing the dev team to change the game or someone to make a addon or something for it. In the end, its just a matter of which side have the more support going for them, and right now the conservationist side is winning.

  • 1.THIS IS SPARTA MINECRAFT! this is a world of floating dirt, coal fired furnaces with no exhaust, and the ability to stuff server hundred cubic meters of stone in my jeans pocket NOTHING is for sure
    2. if realism is applied to green energy then it has to be applied to all energy therefore re-leveling the playing field and keeping solar "on top" as some would put it
    3. the user base is used to a certain level of convenience and fun if you want things to be harder play terrafirma craft
    4. if your proposing a nerf do to an experience you had in a smp environment take it up with your sever admin
    5. if your proposing a nerf do to an experience you had in a ssp environment then shut the hell up you can't tell me how to play

    1) Hey,that's not that WE can change,but we're talking about things,we can affect.Maybe the feature would be added someday.Notch is obviosly,strange person,to add things like new planks,correcting some bugs and doing such stuff for months,while it is obvious,that minecraft itself isn't worth alot of play-time w/o mods.Vanilla minecraft is vanilla and mods are to bring new gameplay and complexity.
    2)ehem..didn't get it
    3)I sure enjoy it and would like things to become less straight-forwarded.Bringing complexity and different/difficult changes.If you don't need some functions,just dont use them.
    4)ehem,no.I am admin myself.
    5)ehem,no.I am not telling you anything.I am suggesting and ideas are to be polished to perfection,not just "maan thats too dificult/unusual/strange looking and smelling/OP",as this sucks

  • 1) Hey,that's not that WE can change,but we're talking about things,we can affect.Maybe the feature would be added someday.Notch is obviosly,strange person,to add things like new planks,correcting some bugs and doing such stuff for months,while it is obvious,that minecraft itself isn't worth alot of play-time w/o mods.Vanilla minecraft is vanilla and mods are to bring new gameplay and complexity.
    2)ehem..didn't get it
    3)I sure enjoy it and would like things to become less straight-forwarded.Bringing complexity and different/difficult changes.If you don't need some functions,just dont use them.
    4)ehem,no.I am admin myself.
    5)ehem,no.I am not telling you anything.I am suggesting and ideas are to be polished to perfection,not just "maan thats too dificult/unusual/strange looking and smelling/OP",as this sucks

    1) yes you can change that ask the forge devs for more hooks. until then what you want to do is to stick an accurate scale model of an ak47 in the hand of a lego minifig it looks stupid
    2)if you think solars or green gens are op as implemented then using the realism argument is the wrong approach because it would be unrealistic for those same nerfs to not be applied to the fuel consuming gens
    3)if i make the game easier you can take up challenges to get your difficulty fix if you make the game harder those changes won't be optional for me
    4)then install terrafima craft smp now
    5)you think this sucks and yet your playing it? industrial craft isn't about polish its about utility i think your shopping in the wrong store dude

    true balance is impossible in video games the best one can hope for is to make it really hard to guess which of 2 choices are better.
    and remember kids "NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF JOKES!"