[GregTech-5][1.7.10-FORGE-1355+][Unofficial but approved Port][Stable] Even GT5 Experimental is slowly getting stable.

    When using the Small Coal Boiler and the High Pressure Coal Boiler, the boiler correctly deposits the water from Water Buckets into the block's internal reservoir... but it does not give the player back the empty buckets.


    Using latest build of 5.09.02

    Quote from SpwnX

    maybe if you use a "pressurized" pipe line, that might not be a problem (pump covers on every pipe + shutter covers aswell to prevent backflow)


    Well, I though about that, but I would be a lot more expansive. Seems that I'll have to put the turbine as close I from my tank...


    Edit: I'm watching her videos now, thanks Willis!

    I'm making a LHE to large HP turbine to large steam turbine setup. While recycling the distilled water I still have to run a distillation tower almost constantly. I've tried to make sure there are no plumbing problems and optimal flows are hit (1 B/s of lava to run two normal tungstensteel turbines: 10000 L/s). Is there a mistake with the assumptions I'm making about ratios?

    The LHE HPTurbine combo has been tested to be a perfect closed loop. So it does now work if everything is done right. It is just easy to have something overflow. For example the LHE output hatch is a guess in your build. Maybe your pipes overflow or how do you split evenly between two turbines?

    I made a mistake thinking that the flow was 20000 L/s when it's twice that. I ran into plumbing problems because a single huge tungstensteel pipe wasn't big enough so I just put the LHE and two turbines right next to each other. Using a large sterling silver blade (39000 L/s) and I'm still running into the same issue. Maybe I will have to work out a 4 turbine setup.

    Quote from willis936

    I'm making a LHE to large HP turbine to large steam turbine setup. While recycling the distilled water I still have to run a distillation tower almost constantly. I've tried to make sure there are no plumbing problems and optimal flows are hit (1 B/s of lava to run two normal tungstensteel turbines: 10000 L/s). Is there a mistake with the assumptions I'm making about ratios?


    Heya willis


    Ratios are fine. Where people usually lose distilled water is when the various hatches fill up.


    If a hatch accepting steam or distilled water ever completely fills up, any excess is instantly voided. It usually indicates that you're generating too much steam for your turbines to handle.

    Just noticed that the wiki says it outputs half as much as it actually does. No idea how i did that, but the turbine gives out 80L steam per 1L lava. Not 40L. Just to declare it not OP, the HP Lava Boiler produces 100L Steam per 1L lava and i lowered it from 150L. No one cared about that one even before i lowered it.

    Quote from Blood Asp

    Just noticed that the wiki says it outputs half as much as it actually does. No idea how i did that, but the turbine gives out 80L steam per 1L lava. Not 40L. Just to declare it not OP, the HP Lava Boiler produces 100L Steam per 1L lava and i lowered it from 150L. No one cared about that one even before i lowered it.


    It's not OP in my eyes because it isn't the stopgap quick n dirty solution it used to be. You practically need an engineering degree to have a proper setup and even then you'll eat lava so fast you'll have to replace a nether pump daily.


    On a related note: now that I know how much steam that makes I'll probably throttle lava consumption to 250 L/s and use a configuration 5 IC, take the 7.5% hit in efficiency, and use 20000 L/s turbines (there seem to be a lot of those and plumbing is easier with only one pair of turbines.

    Quote from willis936

    On a related note: now that I know how much steam that makes I'll probably throttle lava consumption to 250 L/s and use a configuration 5 IC, take the 7.5% hit in efficiency, and use 20000 L/s turbines (there seem to be a lot of those and plumbing is easier with only one pair of turbines.

    AFAIK, there is not a Large Turbine in a single HP Steam or normal Steam Large Turbine that will handle a maxed-out LHE. If you're max'ing out your LHE and want to maintain a closed loop (i.e. lose no steam, lose no water), you will need to either:


    A) Use multiple (2x HP and 2x normal = 4x total) Large Turbines
    B) Throttle lava input into LHE
    C) Throttle LHE efficiency using chip
    D) Use a Huge Turbine wheel/blade in the HP Steam and the normal Steam Large Turbine

    I have really enjoyed the power progression in GT:U and look forward to the planned changes.


    I limited my pre-LHE steam to the Bronze and LV era, used Fuel in the MV era, steam-less Fission the HV era, LHE (steam) in the EV era, and am using Fusion in IV and beyond.


    I wouldn't mind a simple option in a config file to enforce this progression by, for example:

    • removing Advanced and Turbo Steam Turbine
    • removing Turbo Diesel Generator
    • prevent LV Transformer from up-transforming to MV
    • prevent MV Transformer from up-transforming to HV
    • prevent LV and MV Battery buffers from accepting lower-tier power


    This would make spamming Railcraft or GT Steam Boilers much less attractive. Tree farms for steam power would also be far less attractive as a long-term solution. As a bonus to prevent tree farm-powered Large Steam Turbines, one might restrict/limit the kind of steam accepted by the normal Large Turbine to the steam produced by the LHE only. But, that might going a bit too far for some.


    And, since not everyone would enjoy such a forced progression, a config option is probably best.

    Right now I'm throttling LHE input to 1 B/s using a fluid regulator. This is also the max production rate of the one HV pump I'm using. A single pair of turbines (one HP and one steam) can hit almost max using a large sterling silver (cheap material) turbine (39 B/s) if the rate is limited to 500 mB/s. However this also requires the integrated circuits to be used. It ends up being a tricky problem. Ideally I'd like to run 4 pairs of turbines using normal tungstensteel rotors but I first need the tungsten. This setup by my best guess will need the pump to be moved every 10 ish hours and produce 400 ish tungsten. That's enough to do whatever I want. It needs a 20 MV centrifuge array to keep up with 1 B/s of lava (10 for 500 mB/s and 5 for 250 mB/s).


    After some experimentation I'm not certain I can get 250 mB/s to work in HP mode reliably. Still need to play around more though.


    I agree with everything here except disabling up-conversion via transformers or battery buffers. If I'm legitimately generating 32 + 32 + 32 + 32 = 128 eu/t, then I should be able to power something that requires that much power.


    It also provides interesting routes to objectives without limiting players to a very linear progression path.


    "Configs" notwithstanding. Perhaps I should have said "I'd probably use all of these config options except for..." :)

    Quote from Blood Asp

    Just noticed that the wiki says it outputs half as much as it actually does. No idea how i did that, but the turbine gives out 80L steam per 1L lava. Not 40L. Just to declare it not OP, the HP Lava Boiler produces 100L Steam per 1L lava and i lowered it from 150L. No one cared about that one even before i lowered it.


    I just realized another reason I like this: while you can hit a higher lava to steam conversion ratio using an array of lava boilers you will never come close to matching the lava to EU conversion ratio. High pressure to steam turbines are just 2gud. Admittedly very annoying to automate in any meaningful way.


    Also from the wiki:
    http://ftb.gamepedia.com/Large…nger#Integrated_Circuitry

    Quote

    There are 25 valid integrated circuit configurations: each one (beyond 1) will reduce the threshold by 150L, but decrease the efficiency of the conversion by 1.5%. Therefore an integrated circuit in configuration-10 will only require 4000-((10-1)*150) = 2650L/sec Hot Coolant per second to generate approximately 1146L/t superheated steam (for 86.5% efficiency).


    This rhetoric implies the math works the same between both lava and hot coolant but after thinking about it that doesn't make sense. Does the threshold change for lava move by 150/4 (37.5) for each IC value? The four I'm thinking of comes from the fact that the hot coolant threshold is four times higher than the lava threshold.

    I´m not sure, but couldn´t you just set the efficiency of advanced and the turbo steam turbine and the efficiency of the turbo diesel generator to 0? It would be practically removed, if you do so.

    Quote from dohvakin96

    I´m not sure, but couldn´t you just set the efficiency of advanced and the turbo steam turbine and the efficiency of the turbo diesel generator to 0? It would be practically removed, if you do so.

    Sure, and I'm pretty sure Minetweaker could remove the recipe entirely and hide it in NEI, but the point was to discuss how to strongly or softly enforce a power tiering. For example, It's a shame when I hear (read) about players that spam tree farms, then complain about the pack being dull or some power sources being useless or redundant.


    I have been there and done that and I have also done worlds where I change power sources many times. A changing world is a living world and is usually more fun :D

    Quote from willis936

    Admittedly very annoying to automate in any meaningful way.


    I automated my HP + Normal Large Turbines roughly by doing the following:

    • Picking a the 'best' rotor that I could build. In my case, it was Tungstensteel Large since I had enough Tungstensteel. Your case might be different.
    • Computing the LHE output steam flow rate to match that. Note that you can overdrive or underdrive the 'Optimal Flow Rate' of the rotor by 25% and not pay a penalty.
    • Chipping the LHE to achieve that flow rate, making sure to stay within +/- 25% of the turbine Optimal Flow Rate.
    • Matching the lava or hot coolant input to (slightly) exceed the chipping minimum, again making sure to stay +/- 25% of the turbine rotor Optimal Flow Rate.


    The reason why I recommend starting at the rotor and working backwards is the rotor is usually the critical element that can't easily be upgraded/downgraded without significant infrastructure changes (improvements).


    Also note the De-assembler in 5.0.8.28 and later can successfully return all/most/some of the used (worn) rotor parts. I'm using the 8192v version, and it is indeed 100% efficient, returning *all* rotor parts. I just have to re-assemble to get a brand-new rotor. This means really expensive, but really useful rotors are viable.

    By automate I mean get set up so I don't need to touch it. I have yet to experiment with opencomputers robots. They may be able to see the state of the blade and stand in front of the block while not violating the "empty" requirement. If both of those things are true then I can have a robot stand in a charging area, walk up to the turbine every 10 seconds, check the durability, if less than 10% swap with a fresh one in inventory, if none in inventory take out anyway, dump damaged rotors into a disassembler tied to an AE2 network. AE2 can be used to autocraft the rotors using a level detector. I already have an AE2 EBF so tungstensteel can be generated.


    From there the LHE can shut itself off by using a fluid detector on the output hatch (if steam output full or distilled water input not full, turn off).


    The real trick is getting enough tungsten starting off since I have no source of it. Once the lava LHE system is running I'll be covered in it. I'll likely do a stopgap rotor choice and replace with tungstensteel later. This will require a shut down system of some sort to prevent losing the rotor (or explosion if that happens). machine controller + redstone receiver isn't possible right now so idk what I'm going to do.

    Quote from MigukNamja

    Sure, and I'm pretty sure Minetweaker could remove the recipe entirely and hide it in NEI, but the point was to discuss how to strongly or softly enforce a power tiering. For example, It's a shame when I hear (read) about players that spam tree farms, then complain about the pack being dull or some power sources being useless or redundant.


    I have been there and done that and I have also done worlds where I change power sources many times. A changing world is a living world and is usually more fun :D


    easy fix: remove MFR. Forestry tree farms are weak. I have two open computers robot based tree farms running and it's enough to run somewhere between 1 and 2 large boilers (writing the governors for these is fun. Lots of little min/maxing things can be done. No PID required). The progression you outlined is almost exactly how my pack is going. Lots of IC2 EU nuclear. Moving towards fluid mode reactors and eyes on fusion. Also using minetweaker to nerf things as it's seen fit is nice. You can shape the progression exactly the way you want it. It's a fair bit of effort but considering I play hundreds of hours on a pack I'd say it's worth it. Plus you have a base for a future pack.

    Quote from willis936

    http://ftb.gamepedia.com/Large…nger#Integrated_Circuitry[/url]


    This rhetoric implies the math works the same between both lava and hot coolant but after thinking about it that doesn't make sense. Does the threshold change for lava move by 150/4 (37.5) for each IC value? The four I'm thinking of comes from the fact that the hot coolant threshold is four times higher than the lava threshold.


    I wrote that wiki (and that code) so if something's botched, my bad. And I did 95% of my testing with Hot Coolant rather than Lava.


    The effect of the integrated circuit is 1.5% inefficiency and 150L threshold decrease per IC level. But while the Lava inefficiency tracks proportionately (1.5%), the Lava threshold doesn't. So I see where your concern is: Given that the Lava threshold is only 25% that of Hot Coolant, Lava should definitely drop by 37.5L per IC level.


    Good catch.


    (Also: What rhetoric? :p)


    edit: looking at the code, it appears I subtract 150L in both cases, but then divide by 4 later to get the Lava threshold. Are you able to test this? Hopefully this is just a fix that needs doing in the wiki, not the code.