IC2 Phoning Home...?

    Quote from Saul_Goode

    WTF RichardG? Are you ashamed or something? Are you afraid of your own words? Pre-planning or not, 6 months ago or not... it's still the direction that you were headed and the direction that it took other people to steer you away from. The fact that you run from your own words and actions shows shame. It's the direction that YOU wanted to take and it shows your intent.


    Quote from The Original Technic Pack Readme

    I did not get permission from anyone and I didn't even bother asking. The Minecraft modding community is terrible and the egos some of the modders themselves have is incredibly terrible. I simply made this pack because I love these mods and want other people to experience them as well with as little work on their part as possible.


    If you want to yell at people for their intended actions about a year ago, the technic team is a great place to start!


    Quote from Saul_Goode


    Honestly wish I hadn't ever said anything. In the beginning it was just a small issue that got blown out of proportion by over-defensive fanboys. Now it feel like I opened a closet and got buried under a pile of skeletons. For me this all started because I was on the bug tracker and saw a bug report about a server that undeservedly found itself on the blacklist. Over-defensive of the devs and overzealous in their dislike for all things tekkit they harassed the OP for 2... 3? pages before anything happened.


    Yes, that happened, yeah, it was uncalled for, but I don't see how this is relevant to this thread.


    Quote from Saul_Goode


    Anyway... seeing that IC2 had a blacklist, I was like 'What's it take to end up on that? Did IC2's mod pack requirements change?' Nope not really... But while looking round I saw some theoretical weaknesses had been introduced with no notification... Really... just a small gripe. Made a quick comment about it's lameness and out come the wolves that can't stand the idea that someone would have the audacity to question the Great and All-Powerful Mod Developer.


    Welcome to the Minecraft modding community, where there are two sides to every issue, and absolutely no gray area.


    Quote from Saul_Goode


    Long story short... defend my views, come to find out that my doomsday theories are a bit closer to reality than I initially realized...


    I don't know about that, there's been a lot of drama throughout modded Minecraft's history, the community has survived one way or another.


    Quote from Saul_Goode


    If unauthorized mod pack usage is really that grave of a concern then you're going to have to be more creative and have more conviction than has been shown. Tekkit users had their worlds exploded by unauthorized usage and barely cared, what difference is a 3 second line of nag text in an otherwise fully functional package really going to accomplish?


    Barely cared? Are you sure about that? It was like one or two species of bees that caused minor explosions and everybody was like "MA WURLD'S BEEN GRIEFED!", Sengir is still hated in the Technic community. I'm pretty certain that modders generally prefer to avoid unnecessary drama, the amount of backlash the actions you are advocating here would be immense for a mod that has been around as long as IC2 compared to just a simple blacklist that could be avoided with 5 seconds of reading before clicking the download button.

    Is the answer to this question no?


    Quote

    Hey don't take it so hard. Ignorance is part of this generation it seems. -the wise words of XFmax-o-l

    Quote from MagusUnion


    1) Name the server, and any launchers used it its creation


    2) You do realize that the next step would be selective save world destruction, should it boil down to that point again, correct?


    1) Link - Other factors aside, in this instance it was found that the mod pack WAS on the list erroneously. If a developer is going to implement a blacklist then they are responsible for ensuring that the contents are correct and accurate. Due diligence.


    2) No. I don't see that. I myself have offered up two (TWO! and that's barely sparing any brain function for the task!) alternative options that are both non-destructive and far more effective than this.


    • Crash the client with a 'IndustrialCraft2 is not authorized for use with this modpack' message similar to the multiplayer version check.
    • Disable all IC2 functionality when xxx pack is detected while leaving all other functionality unaffected. Users can still play, just not with IC2.

    I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.

    The mod pack was assembled via the Technic Launcher. Hence why it was targeted... If they used FTB (or any other launcher for that matter), this wouldn't have been an issue. Does that mean that mod authors are giving autonomy to FTB alone? Perhaps, but at least we know that FTB will be dedicated 100% to Minecraft mods, and not include some backdoor recruiting scheme to add more members to the SA forums...


    Your solutions also assume a level of inhuman benevolence from mod authors. Basically, your saying that they shouldn't backlash in a violent, semi-destructive manner. Yet you couldn't even do that yourself with RichardG in a forum post. And he's the one you say has an unhealthy mentality?

    Would anyone like to try a Slowpoke Tail?! Only 1 Million Yen!


    Quote

    this isn't about arrogance or ego, I have a block that I put a lot of freaking work into


    Every Mod Author, in existence. And yet, you STILL say otherwise.

    Quote from MagusUnion


    1) The mod pack was assembled via the Technic Launcher. Hence why it was targeted...


    2) ...and not include some backdoor recruiting scheme to add more members to the SA forums...


    3) Your solutions also assume a level of inhuman benevolence from mod authors. Basically, your saying that they shouldn't backlash in a violent, semi-destructive manner. Yet you couldn't even do that yourself with RichardG in a forum post. And he's the one you say has an unhealthy mentality?


    1) So? It was a mod pack that was assembled, but did not include IC2. Therefore should not have been targeted. Even if a mod pack does not have permission to include a particular mod does not mean that the end-users are restricted from adding it. Due diligence... the person that set the standards and compiled the list failed at it.


    2) and what? a backdoor recruiting-scheme to add more members to the FTB forums is magically better?


    3) Your comment assumes that I object to violent, semi-destructive reactions from mod devs when their work is hijacked for personal gain.


    I don't.


    I sympathize with the affected, unsuspecting end-users, but the developer in me rolls on the floor imagining the panic the Tekkit compilers experienced as they started to figure out what was going on and why. The comment I was responding to implied that there were no options between blacklist and explosions. I was showing that I had already offered 2 other options. For the intended goal of hindering unauthorized usage my solutions are both more creative and more effective.


    As far as my reaction to RichardG... the dude had just (ab)used his power and position to censor content that didn't break any rules, it just used his own words to show how far he was going to go with it before people pointed out that his plans were illegal (shit, +1 for 'the Forge guys and Alblaka'). If the quotes were inaccurate or used out of context then he should have addressed that and disputed the validity. He didn't which leads me to believe it was true and accurate. What sense does censoring the truth make? How is that the right thing to do?


    Quote from CrafterOfMines57

    If you want to yell at people for their intended actions about a year ago, the technic team is a great place to start!


    Don't deny that. I don't agree with what they did. I get why they did it, but intent alone doesn't always make things right. In no way should I be confused with a Tekkit sympathizer.



    Quote from CrafterOfMines57

    Yes, that happened, yeah, it was uncalled for, but I don't see how this is relevant to this thread.


    Relevant to the thread because a server that didn't belong on the list had to jump through hoops to get off the list? Meant to illustrate yet another way this was a flawed implementation.


    Quote from CrafterOfMines57

    Welcome to the Minecraft modding community, where there are two sides to every issue, and absolutely no gray area.


    But how does that have relevance to the associated quote?


    Quote from CrafterOfMines57

    I don't know about that, there's been a lot of drama throughout modded Minecraft's history, the community has survived one way or another.


    Again... relevance is where? All I was saying was that what I initially thought to be a minor theoretical security flaw and a bit of ego stroking actually bordered on spyware implementation 'at the early planning stages'.


    Quote from CrafterOfMines57

    Barely cared? Are you sure about that? It was like one or two species of bees that caused minor explosions and everybody was like "MA WURLD'S BEEN GRIEFED!", Sengir is still hated in the Technic community. I'm pretty certain that modders generally prefer to avoid unnecessary drama, the amount of backlash the actions you are advocating here would be immense for a mod that has been around as long as IC2 compared to just a simple blacklist that could be avoided with 5 seconds of reading before clicking the download button.


    Yes. Sengir is still hated, but that was primarily due to splashback from punishing unsuspecting and 'innocent' users for what was essentially a mod developer\pack compiler issue. On the whole people get that Sengir was protecting his claim and are forgiving for the most part. Protecting his mod wasn't the issue, 'griefing' player worlds was. I have my own problems with Sengir. Exploding bees ain't one of `em.


    I understand that destructive methods would probably backfire against the credibility of the mod, but I don't think that either of the solutions I've mentioned could possibly be viewed as destructive. You'll need to be more specific on how the 'actions I've advocated' would have immense backlash. And how would 5 seconds of reading before clicking solve the problem?

    I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.

    OK, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH...


    Saul Goode, can you provide, ANY proof that there is code in the mod that gives the IC2 devs and testers a special cape. Also, unless your using a VERY early computer and a REALY crap Internet connection, your complaining about "code" that is smaller (in terms of bytes) then a empty notepad document. I said this in my last post here, IT"S A F^&%%$N CAPE, GET OVER IT!!!! It's just somthing to say "I work on/test IC2". Would anyone complain if Krapht or Sengir put a cape code into buildcraft? or how about Xen0 and Pahimar for EE3 and Reliquary? I don't here anyone complain about the Mojang capes. Now PLEASE, DROP THE SUBJECT, and if it's really bugging you, that much, stop playing IC2


    Now if you would excuse me, I have to go calm down

    • Official Post
    Quote from Blaster

    OK, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH...


    Saul Goode, can you provide, ANY proof that there is code in the mod that gives the IC2 devs and testers a special cape. Also, unless your using a VERY early computer and a REALY crap Internet connection, your complaining about "code" that is smaller (in terms of bytes) then a empty notepad document. I said this in my last post here, IT"S A F^&%%$N CAPE, GET OVER IT!!!! It's just somthing to say "I work on/test IC2". Would anyone complain if Krapht or Sengir put a cape code into buildcraft? or how about Xen0 and Pahimar for EE3 and Reliquary? I don't here anyone complain about the Mojang capes. Now PLEASE, DROP THE SUBJECT, and if it's really bugging you, that much, stop playing IC2


    Now if you would excuse me, I have to go calm down

    +1 . Enough talking shit.


    My sincere opinion to Saul Goode :
    I don't give a fuck about capes. It only takes you 3 minutes to load mods because your computer/internet/both are (very) crappy.
    It is NOT cape's fault or any mod developer and they have NO OBLIGATION TO DO WHAT YOU WANT. They are providing you mods for free to play and you still want them to modify their mods due you being selfish? Nope. It is their code and they do whatever they want with it, if they want to implement capes for themselves, its their right to do so. If you don't like those capes just don't use their mods.


    I really would like to close this thread, but i'm not allowed to.

    A thread about CAPES, 6 flippin' pages long?


    [10:23] *Fyre has quit the chat

    You can never have enough Medli IC2.


    Christ... Back to capes again are we?


    Blaster - removed <- Has a list of player and file names that makes it a pretty safe assumption that the functionality is there. But no. I do not have direct proof as I do not have access to the IC2 source code.


    But yes, I agree that you should maybe attempt to calm down a bit. Perhaps a nap in in order?


    It's not about the code or what it does. It's about how it does it and how it was done.


    I don't give a damn about someone having a custom cape. I have one of my own. It was cool for about 45 seconds. Then I put it back into first-person. Then a player on my server saw it, and I asked him if he wanted one. He told me not to bother because he'd never see it.


    SpwnX - How the fuck am I being selfish? You'll need to explain that otherwise I'll be inclined to believe that you are just throwing out baseless accusations with no purpose other than to demonize me. Seriously.... How. Am I. Being Selfish?


    As always, I've been doing my best to be civil and patient by explaining things to people more concerned with hating and defending than they are with thinking and understanding.


    Just because we have a difference of opinion does not justify a complete lack of respect. Hating me more does not make you more right, it just shows that you lack the maturity to engage in disagreement with any sense of maturity.


    What can I say? It's six pages of 'Shut up! You're wrong.' because I know I'm not.


    Quote from GregoriusT

    Quoted from "SpwnX"
    I don't give a fuck about capes.
    *Ahem* weren't you the one, who wanted a "special" GregTech-Cape?


    Erm... I believe they refer to that as being 'busted'.

    I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.

    Edited once, last by RichardG ().

    • Official Post
    Quote from GregoriusT

    *Ahem* weren't you the one, who wanted a "special" GregTech-Cape?

    Correcting, i don't give a fuck about capes "making my minecraft take 0.1 second more to load".
    Even if i didn't have one, the ones who develops (and owns) the mods have their right to add their own capes [including to their donators, like GT and Optifine].
    Seriously, why bothering about capes if they actually do not interfere that much on minecraft loading? Not even one second to me, i believe.

    Quote from SpwnX

    Seriously, why bothering about capes if they actually do not interfere that much on minecraft loading? Not even one second to me, i believe.


    This.

    You can never have enough Medli IC2.


    If it was the mining dead, I swear IC2 was on their initial, very old mod set, and that's been fixed.


    If there's anything Saul is trying to imply, is that I did it while disagreeing with the folks. I agreed with them, it was blatant spyware, and went with an anonymous system.

    • Official Post
    Quote from SpwnX

    Not even one second to me, i believe.

    No idea if it costs my client anytime, when its loading i usualy just stare at the MultiMC Console.
    About 99% of it loading is textures :P

    Quote from SirusKing

    No idea if it costs my client anytime, when its loading i usualy just stare at the MultiMC Console.
    About 99% of it loading is textures :P


    MultiMC is pretty slow (FPS-wise) for me, it ruins my modpack plans :(

    You can never have enough Medli IC2.


    ofc it doesn't affect load time, if you'd seen what I posted here:

    Quote

    as for time wasted, for the global average internet connection (13 Mbits/sec), it would take 1/1267th of a second to download that file
    assuming you have abysmal internet (10 Kbits/sec), it would still take less than a second to download the file

    • Official Post
    Quote from Fyre


    MultiMC is pretty slow (FPS-wise) for me, it ruins my modpack plans :(

    Quite a few people complain about that, i find it fine though,

    RichardG: Would it just be fine if you moved the cape files to a different text document, and then added a config option to disable that checking? Don't know about the Tekkit stuff though.