[GregTech-6][1.7.10] Moved to Website [Closed]

Quote from Kane Hart

GregTech is suppose to Alter the gameplay including any and all mods he deems to be to easy and wants to change it up a bit and make it more challenging. This his how his mod works. You just pretty much said for Greg to fuck off. Don't use his mod if you don't like it. His mode is meant to be a balance to many mods but also provide more things to to end game.

This guy is a saviour in my books. To many mods have become to easy and boring. FTB and Tekkit are nothing but creative mode packs.

Like I said, IMHO. I think if a mod like RP2 or xycraft that don't have apis shouldn't really be altered until the modder says they can, and I highly doubt that elo has said greg could change rp2. He can go ahead and fuck with ic2, buildcraft, forestry, whatever mod has an api and I don't care, but when he goes ahead and alters a mod that doesn't have an api I think he is going past his limits. And that's the reason why the mod I am codding won't have an api as I wouldn't want people to change it.

Quote from Kane Hart

]GregTech is suppose to Alter the gameplay including any and all mods he deems to be to easy and wants to change it up a bit and make it more challenging. This his how his mod works. You just pretty much said for Greg to fuck off. Don't use his mod if you don't like it. His mode is meant to be a balance to many mods but also provide more things to to end game.

This guy is a saviour in my books. To many mods have become to easy and boring. FTB and Tekkit are nothing but creative mode packs.

Greg is one person. Greg does not have any authority over what is 'balanced'. If Greg believes that his opinion supersedes that of the other mod makers, then, yes, Greg should fuck off. Don't call Greg a 'savior'. He already has enough of an apparent god complex as it is. GregTech adds a lot of neat things, but it's polluted by all the things it seeks to 'better'.

If you want a really challenging game- and this is a serious recommendation- check out Wurm Online.

Quote from damonster81

Like I said, IMHO. I think if a mod like RP2 or xycraft that don't have apis shouldn't really be altered until the modder says they can, and I highly doubt that elo has said greg could change rp2. He can go ahead and fuck with ic2, buildcraft, forestry, whatever mod has an api and I don't care, but when he goes ahead and alters a mod that doesn't have an api I think he is going past his limits. And that's the reason why the mod I am codding won't have an api as I wouldn't want people to change it.

Altering a recipe is not altering a mod. He could easily use the same recipe and set it to priority override. That is like someone using a item ID from RP default. Do you demand them to shut down their mod?

Quote from Almanorek

]GregTech is suppose to Alter the gameplay including any and all mods he deems to be to easy and wants to change it up a bit and make it more challenging. This his how his mod works. You just pretty much said for Greg to fuck off. Don't use his mod if you don't like it. His mode is meant to be a balance to many mods but also provide more things to to end game.

Greg is one person. Greg does not have any authority over what is 'balanced'. If Greg believes that his opinion supersedes that of the other mod makers, then, yes, Greg should fuck off. Don't call Greg a 'savior'. He already has enough of an apparent god complex as it is. GregTech adds a lot of neat things, but it's polluted by all the things it seeks to 'better'.

If you want a really challenging game- and this is a serious recommendation- check out Wurm Online.

Whoa whoa whoa people, calm your tits. There's this little thing called the ForgeOreDictionary, what it does is allow for cross mod use. Also what this means, (unless there is a special tool-tip associated with it) is that all mods can modify the recipe, as this is not touching their code in the slightest. And if any of you are telling him to "fuck off", why don't you excercise your brains a little, and turn OFF the config for it. Seriously, grow a pair, and stop bitching at greg. If you can't seem to manage this, there are at least 5 different packs, of which i think only ONE has the hard mode recipes on by default. So please, be respectful to greg, he labours to give us a wonderful mod, that allows those of us that enjoy challenge in minecraft, to keep discovering and playing.

#rantover
Also, hey Greg, have you taken a look at minechem 2? There is possibility for some amazing cross mod play there, as it puts dozens of elements, and compounds into the game

Quote from Sirbab

Whoa whoa whoa people, calm your tits. There's this little thing called the ForgeOreDictionary, what it does is allow for cross mod use. Also what this means, (unless there is a special tool-tip associated with it) is that all mods can modify the recipe, as this is not touching their code in the slightest. And if any of you are telling him to "fuck off", why don't you excercise your brains a little, and turn OFF the config for it. Seriously, grow a pair, and stop bitching at greg. If you can't seem to manage this, there are at least 5 different packs, of which i think only ONE has the hard mode recipes on by default. So please, be respectful to greg, he labours to give us a wonderful mod, that allows those of us that enjoy challenge in minecraft, to keep discovering and playing.

The config is completely meaningless. The default is how Greg chooses to present his mod. What's more, it says this: "I know how to balance your mod better than you do." Every time Greg alters a recipe, he says he's better than the original mod's creator. Whether or not this is intentional is irrelevant.

And I am growing a pair. By not mindlessly embracing an exercise in bad design.

Quote from Kane Hart

Altering a recipe is not altering a mod.

Quote from RichardG

RedPower is a special case. Eloraam dislikes people tampering with her mod.

And, given that she has 0 legal ground to stand on, why should we cater to her whims?

Quote from BrickedKeyboard

And, given that she has 0 legal ground to stand on, why should we cater to her whims?

Because that's unethical?

Oh, and also because RedPower is copyrighted, and as such, falls under copyright law. (AKA legal ground.)

Quote from Almanorek

Because that's unethical?

Oh, and also because RedPower is copyrighted, and as such, falls under copyright law. (AKA legal ground.)

Right, and what greg is doing does NOT fall under copy right law, or any law whatsoever. It is completely legal and ethical. Basically some code in redpower adds some numbers to a table. Greg's code reads that same table, sees numbers it doesn't like, and changes them. No redpower copyrighted material is copied or distributed.

Quote from Almanorek

The config is completely meaningless. The default is how Greg chooses to present his mod. What's more, it says this: "I know how to balance your mod better than you do." Every time Greg alters a recipe, he says he's better than the original mod's creator. Whether or not this is intentional is irrelevant.

And I am growing a pair. By not mindlessly embracing an exercise in bad design.

Quote from Almanorek

The config is completely meaningless. The default is how Greg chooses to present his mod. What's more, it says this: "I know how to balance your mod better than you do." Every time Greg alters a recipe, he says he's better than the original mod's creator. Whether or not this is intentional is irrelevant.

And I am growing a pair. By not mindlessly embracing an exercise in bad design.

You somehow think that every modder (all 50+ individual people) have perfect understanding of game balance and all want the same difficulty for the overall game? That, say, Alblaka was incapable of making a mistake 2 years ago when he came up with the first recipes for IC2, for a game that no one had played in SMP before?

It's not necessarily just that Greg knows better...though he arguably does...it's that certain conventions are so ingrained that no one wants to change them. Or, in the case of Eloraam, she has stated publically that she DOES want to change the recipes, she just has not yet gotten around to doing so.

None of the copyrighted content is being altered.
Altering recipes is easy and is done by many other mods, 1 mods sole purpose is the alteration of recipes.

As far as ethical grounds, the default setting for the recipe alteration is set to false, it doesn't even change the recipe unless the user chooses to do so.
So far the only mods gregtech changes by default are IC2, BC, Vanilla, and removes an exploit when IC2 and Forestry are in use together.

If your saying that gregtech should remove the ability for the user to easily alter a recepie if they so choose then you are also saying that mods like Customstuff and Customrecipes that allow the user to easily alter recipes should also be squashed.

Oh my, you do know that mods are only balanced for their mod alone right? i'll start off here with a spoiler, so as not to pollute the thread too much.

Quote from BrickedKeyboard

You somehow think that every modder (all 50+ individual people) have perfect understanding of game balance and all want the same difficulty for the overall game? That, say, Alblaka was incapable of making a mistake 2 years ago when he came up with the first recipes for IC2, for a game that no one had played in SMP before?

It's not necessarily just that Greg knows better...though he arguably does...it's that certain conventions are so ingrained that no one wants to change them. Or, in the case of Eloraam, she has stated publically that she DOES want to change the recipes, she just has not yet gotten around to doing so.

I think that the teams in charge of the major mods know what they're doing better than Greg does. And if you have a problem, you should take it up with those people. If you're right, chances are they'll change. But chances are, you aren't right. At least not in most cases. Mods are organic, and change over time. It's up to the makers and the community to gradually shift towards what is considered 'balanced' under a consensus. It's not up for one person to say, "No, I can do it better."

And what exactly is so special about Greg that makes him know better? Because he made a mod?

And the teams in charge of FTB decided that greg DOES know what he's doing, so please, hush now. if you don't like the mod, turn off the interferences, and go your separate way.

Quote from Sirbab

Meaningless? Let me grab a section for you,

addonrecipes { = this section is a simple true/false setup, true means on, false means disabled, pretty standard there.

block { = oh look, Id's next to blocks, this must be where i can change id settings

cheaperrecipes { = can you really not understand this? true turns the original cheaper recipe on, false leaves the more difficult one on

circuitry { = allows for cross mod circuitry usage. I can go on, but if you can't understand this, how are you able to use CC codes? i think you are just unwilling to read the section names

And finally, let me quote something DIRECTLY from sir Greg
"I don't say, your "insert whatever here" is bad,
I'm only showing possibilities for making it better."

This part here shows how to extend and enrich gameplay, he never bashes other mods, only makes them better when paired together, please learn to config, use another pack version, and stop complaining to the author. I don't like People being able to chunkload everywhere on my server, what did we do? WE TURNED THEM OFF IN THE CONFIG. (people these days, i swear)

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You seem to have confused 'meaningless' with 'useless'. Yes, obviously, the config serves a function to alter the game, however, being able to remove a change doesn't stop it being there by default, which is, again, how the mod presents itself.

Example: All tools were reduced to a 10th of their durability, and all EU gains were similarly reduced. There is an option in the config to disable this. Is this acceptable, because it makes the game harder, and it's 'in the config'? Or is it a superfluous, unwanted change, that should be removed?

Quote from Almanorek

The config is completely meaningless. The default is how Greg chooses to present his mod. What's more, it says this: "I know how to balance your mod better than you do." Every time Greg alters a recipe, he says he's better than the original mod's creator. Whether or not this is intentional is irrelevant.

And I am growing a pair. By not mindlessly embracing an exercise in bad design.

Considering most mods or mod addons don't take cross-mod interaction into account whatsoever; in this case, this is correct. In order to balance recipes to a more difficult degree while taking cross-mod interaction into account recipes needed to change. Take forestry and IC2 bronze for a perfect example. Both use the exact same 3-1 conversion of copper and tin. The only difference being people received 4 bronze ingots in forestry to 2 in IC2. Both balanced in their own right to vanilla minecraft as forestry makes much larger use of bronze than IC2; however it has no automated means to retrieve said ores. The time investment made up for a larger number of ingots per component. IC2 however adds basic automation via Miners. A balance descrepency arises and (myself included) most people took the easy route to get the most of their components by using forestry bronze for all their bronze needs. That seems to me to be the route GregTech is going (along with adding very high tier items -- more goals than just -- mine to layer 12; get iron on the way, smelt iron, gather some tin / copper, grab redstone, grab diamond; make quarry and creative mode ahoy).

Seriously? Are we really having a debate on who knows what is best for a sandbox game? The point of Minecraft is to do what you want to do, mods extend that capability, and so with GregTech if you have people that think that modded gameplay in its current state is too easy, you use the GregTech config file to ramp the difficulty up, if you think it is too hard, you use the config file to take the difficulty down. I don't see what is so controversial about this.

Quote from Almanorek

Because that's unethical?

Oh, and also because RedPower is copyrighted, and as such, falls under copyright law. (AKA legal ground.)

Why does if always come to that fucking copyright bullshit in EVERY thread that involves redpower in any way? Are all redpower users lawyers/record industry managers/musicians/etc? It's getting annoying. I really wish mojang would force an open source policy on any and all minecraft mod to stop that...
Hell, if i was a better coder myself i'd probably write a mod to really screw some (not named here) people seriously over, just for the fun and the tears.
Rant mode: Disengage. For now.

Quote from Sirbab

And the teams in charge of FTB decided that greg DOES know what he's doing, so please, hush now. if you don't like the mod, turn off the interferences, and go your separate way.

As the people in charge of 'Feed the Beast', as far as I can tell, have only 'proven' themselves by assembling a mod pack, well, I don't put any stock in that.

I only complain as much as I do because I think GregTech, and, frankly, Greg himself, have so much potential, but he has a huge ego and sense of childishness that's holding them both back.