[IC2 Exp][1.7.10] Advanced Machines 1.1.6

I hate to add to the rampant complaining in this thread but even I mostly wanted this mod to avoid using upgrades...

I do thank you both (pwnedgod and stryker) for trying to keep this mod updated but I'll wait for a fixed version with the original machines.

pwnedgod - The same gui issues that were preventing people from using zip's version. You can't pickup items in SMP with the gui open, thus making the machines almost worthless. I also was still getting it with the last version of yours I tried along with a few other issues, mostly with the textures.

Quote from raa1337

Suggestion:

Rename to 'Abominable Machines'.

That made me laugh so hard. xD Thank you for that.

I'm very sorry atomic for this.. But as you can see this complaint fest is why I knew I couldnt bear to carry on the old advanced machines. Some people are very very stuck in the grass is greener or rose-tinted history mindset. The upgraders were the way IC2 wanted to replace these machines. Can you not all see that? Atomic has done you a great favour by trying to bridge the old and new worlds because I suspect quite frankly that if he hadn't had something to interest him in this mod then what would the point have been? Any person complaining 'bring back the old' you have the power just go do it and leave the rest of us alone please, we're trying to move forward not backwards.

Thanks

Quote from cpw

I'm very sorry atomic for this.. But as you can see this complaint fest is why I knew I couldnt bear to carry on the old advanced machines. Some people are very very stuck in the grass is greener or rose-tinted history mindset. The upgraders were the way IC2 wanted to replace these machines. Can you not all see that? Atomic has done you a great favour by trying to bridge the old and new worlds because I suspect quite frankly that if he hadn't had something to interest him in this mod then what would the point have been? Any person complaining 'bring back the old' you have the power just go do it and leave the rest of us alone please, we're trying to move forward not backwards.

Thanks

Induction Furnace existing in Vanilla IC2 renders all of your logic and arguments invalid, and out of place.

If it was removed from IC2, I'd move on without complaints. However- It exists. It should have counterparts. Either it goes, or counterparts are added. (IE: Normal Advanced Machines.) You cannot bridge the gap between old and new when the Induction Furnace itself hasn't changed, or been removed, at all.

Quote from raa1337

Induction Furnace existing in Vanilla IC2 renders all of your logic and arguments invalid, and out of place.

If it was removed from IC2, I'd move on without complaints. However- It exists. It should have counterparts. Either it goes, or counterparts are added. (IE: Normal Advanced Machines.) You cannot bridge the gap between old and new when the Induction Furnace itself hasn't changed, or been removed, at all.

Too true... Just too true...

cpw, almost all of us would prefer to have choices, use the crazy fast and power hungry upgraded basics, or use the faster than base and slightly more power hungry with multiple input/outputs. I for one used both when they both worked fine. Main workshop, upgraded, sorting and auto crafting room, advanced. Sure, upgrading the machines would be nice, but the crazy amount of nerfing required to 'balance' it is just not worth it is it? You avoided the mod because you didn't want to update it how the community who USES IT wants it, and didn't want the headache. So you understand where all the anger comes from. Basically, it's like this, the community wants one thing, you and atomic want something else, something that infuriates the community and makes you look like a dictator. Which is better, making 2 versions of the mod like everyone is suggesting, thus pleasing all types, those who want the advanced machines, and those who want the newer type of machines. Or simply telling us all to effectively shut the fuck up and take it how you give it? How did that work out for Marglyph of TMI? Or FlowerChild of BTW? Two names that generally cause intense rage from the community.

It all comes down to priorities, is your ego/right to be 'right' more important than satisfying the requests of a community, the same people the mod was initially created to please? I'm not trying to be an ass when I say this, but it needs to be said. Grow the fuck up and learn to compromise. That goes to EVERYONE IN THIS THREAD!!!

I think everyone in this thread needs to calm down, turn off their caps locks, and talk peacefully. In my opinion, this is turning into the reality that Shindou described in the above post, but CPW and Stryker have their reasons to want to move on. Personally, I'm siding with the "get the upgrades out of the machines" side, but that's because of the Induction Furnace not being infested with the upgrades. If the Ind. Furnace was changed by Al and his team, I would be all for the change in the advanced machine setup. But, I need everyone to think clearly for this. It just breaks my heart that Flowerchild/BTW and Mayrglyph/TMI needed to be compared to this situation, but unfortunately this is what it has come to: a big flame-fest of dissatisfied people. The only way to calm everyone down is to give everyone what they want. If i knew Java, I would be porting and bugfixing the original Advanced Machines. But I don't know Java, so I can't. And apparently, the only ones who DO know to code either don't want to be involved or don't want to bring back the basics. So I am simply asking this: Someone make a poll for which version we like better. Only then can we decide which version will continue.

Quote from cpw

The upgraders were the way IC2 wanted to replace these machines. Can you not all see that?

Then let the IC2 developers do it their way, and have an addon to do it the other way. That's the whole point of addons. We're not even asking that this current version be completely scrapped, we just want the option. If it was so important to the IC2 devs to keep things exactly as they want them, this forum wouldn't even exist. It's about choice, and the new version of this mod leaves us without the option to use the machines we've all become used to. Cater to the audience, not of the developers.

Ugh where the hell is zipp when we need him.. these guys are destroying his work. Upgrades are an abomination and I will refuse to use them. Zipp please come back and just port this over PLEASE. We need "classic adv. machines" not this derpy junk. Can't believe someone would just take adv machines "without permission" really and then just go balls out with it and turn it into something completely different. Ugh maybe I'll just play vanilla 1.2 since it just came out and avoid all of this for a while.

Constructive criticism is helpful, downright bashing somebodies work is not.

Give him a break guys, he's only trying to help.

Those saying about the Induction Furnace and such - If Al and the team change it to use upgrade components and such, than there is a possibility of someone making a mod that reverts it to its original (now) state.
Perhaps the team like the Ind Furn how it is?

The best solution would be provide 2 downloads, the new (and in my opinion it is fine) version with upgrades (should the Ind Furn be nerfed, more people will be on board with this) and a second download that is the original Adv Machs.
This would keep both sides of the community happy.
The introduction of components was to allow core IC2 users to get more "bang for their buck" with the machines already present. It takes alot to get the normal ones up to scratch with the Adv ones. And Adv can help a fair bit from mid game to end game. I like the way they worked before, and not a huge fan of them now, but they arn't "awful" by any stretch, he is making it so that they suit the new machine set up for 1.7
Of course the Ind Furn is still present as was, and so I think there should be a ported original version (there already is done by Pwnedgod) on the original thread, but it wouldn't hurt adding it here

As I said in my first post in this thread, I appreciate the time, effort, and skill it takes to code something like this. I'm all for this version of advanced machines, and I'm sure there are people who find it more important than I do to keep things close to core IC2 methodology. Me, I use the electric fishing pole, I use EE to build broken CASUC reactors, and I prefer the old advanced machines. With all due respect, I don't really care what the IC2 devs want their mod to be, but I praise them for building an API and allowing this to even be an option. Again, it's all about freedom of choice.

Quote from Derp420

As I said in my first post in this thread, I appreciate the time, effort, and skill it takes to code something like this. I'm all for this version of advanced machines, and I'm sure there are people who find it more important than I do to keep things close to core IC2 methodology. Me, I use the electric fishing pole, I use EE to build broken CASUC reactors, and I prefer the old advanced machines. With all due respect, I don't really care what the IC2 devs want their mod to be, but I praise them for building an API and allowing this to even be an option. Again, it's all about freedom of choice.

Freedom of choice !

That is what this is all about - so some of you do not like the changes - so maybe the add-on's name should be changed.....
If the add-on's name is changes, would you VERY negative gues leave the developer (AtomicStryker) alone ?

and then, that is where the choice comes in.... this is an add-on, if you do not like it.... don't use it.

personally - I dont think I'm gonna use OC, I might upgrade the machines so they'll run on MV, but that is it - time consumption is not really an issue for me.... As most, or at least some of us, I also use BC. so I could just use pipes to put things in, and take them out again for thus saving time to to it.... and are I could even use adv. pipes, and construct a "chunk-updater block" (or what ever the name") so this would happen even if I'm not "home"

anyway - thank you AtomicStryker for taking time ... and it seems chance ... to take and idea (old add-on) to the next step....
a piece of advice thou, after reading the tread, change the name, please the mob.

/MG0

I've found the best solution is to use 3.4 and just run them with no upgrades, they are pretty much what the original machines were at.

That said, I feel that the best option would be to offer a simple port and then balance, change or develop them further under a different mod name. Regarding your comments about the IC2 devs wanting to phase out AM, cpw, to be fair this is an optional mod, optional being the key term here. AM isn't part of IC2 core nor would I think it should be, but what it does offer is CHOICE. Choice is key in this. The whole concept of modding comes down to a choice. Consider a moment if Mojang were to change Minecraft as to phase out or render mods no longer a viable option. You, and a large part of the community, no doubt would feel this an arbitrary and oppressive move and rightly so.

Advanced machines offers a second tier to processing, one I feel that is better balanced and implemented than the horrible release of upgrades. I put my voice with the others here, again, that Advanced Machines as planned by zip was never meant to include upgrades in its scope. I'm not sure at your resistance to just release a no thrills port, Atomic, but it does feel that you're forcing your interpretation of the mod onto the community that uses it. It's a bit like trying to market Windows ME/Vista to nerds, it's not what they want and they won't have a bar of it. In this case, why develop a mod that the target group rejects and does not like?

Pwnedgod, I did try your mod out for SMP but as stated by someone else before, the gui doesn't work correctly. Tested this on a clean server setup from scratch (no pre existing config or item issues).

Worst comes to worst, one of the players on my server does some game coding and has knowledge of Java, not going to promise anything but if push comes to shove I'll throw this his way and see if he can come up with a working port for 1.71, no upgrades, no changes, no thrills.

Quote from Solymr

I've found the best solution is to use 3.4 and just run them with no upgrades, they are pretty much what the original machines were at.

That said, I feel that the best option would be to offer a simple port and then balance, change or develop them further under a different mod name. Regarding your comments about the IC2 devs wanting to phase out AM, cpw, to be fair this is an optional mod, optional being the key term here. AM isn't part of IC2 core nor would I think it should be, but what it does offer is CHOICE. Choice is key in this. The whole concept of modding comes down to a choice. Consider a moment if Mojang were to change Minecraft as to phase out or render mods no longer a viable option. You, and a large part of the community, no doubt would feel this an arbitrary and oppressive move and rightly so.

Advanced machines offers a second tier to processing, one I feel that is better balanced and implemented than the horrible release of upgrades. I put my voice with the others here, again, that Advanced Machines as planned by zip was never meant to include upgrades in its scope. I'm not sure at your resistance to just release a no thrills port, Atomic, but it does feel that you're forcing your interpretation of the mod onto the community that uses it. It's a bit like trying to market Windows ME/Vista to nerds, it's not what they want and they won't have a bar of it. In this case, why develop a mod that the target group rejects and does not like?

Pwnedgod, I did try your mod out for SMP but as stated by someone else before, the gui doesn't work correctly. Tested this on a clean server setup from scratch (no pre existing config or item issues).

Worst comes to worst, one of the players on my server does some game coding and has knowledge of Java, not going to promise anything but if push comes to shove I'll throw this his way and see if he can come up with a working port for 1.71, no upgrades, no changes, no thrills.

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I don't even fix the SMP.

Pwnedgod will you fix it? If you can Thanks!

Quote from Chaosoul

Pwnedgod will you fix it? If you can Thanks!

Lacks of SMP knowledge = no.

Very nice update. Additive macerating is a simple but brilliant idea. Well done. I may have switched over to this version because of this update if you hadn't immediately followed up by insulting a large portion of your potential userbase. Adding cool stuff like this is how you bring people over to your vision of the mod, not calling them whiners and saying they don't deserve it because they wanted a choice.

Wow. Now we can automatically create alloy dust inside the Macerator? Now that's a god send, thanks AtomicStryker!